0 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,689 MW LA 1973-05-13 Sudras Hear from Scientists 1 00:00:04,690 --> 00:00:07,799 ANNOUNCER: Next is a morning walk conversation 2 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:13,989 with His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda, 3 00:00:13,990 --> 00:00:21,879 recorded on May 13th, 1973, in Los Angeles. 4 00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:29,039 PRABHUPĀDA: …got simply the belly and legs, then it is a dead body. 5 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:34,199 It cannot work properly. 6 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:42,739 The brain is lost; therefore they are mad after so much advancement of civilization. 7 00:00:42,740 --> 00:00:46,499 They’re exactly like cats and dogs. 8 00:00:46,500 --> 00:00:49,519 As soon as you enter some country, dog, watchdog: 9 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:50,478 “Wowf! Wowf! 10 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:51,765 Why you have come? 11 00:00:51,766 --> 00:00:53,209 What is your business?” 12 00:00:53,210 --> 00:00:56,139 This is dog’s business. 13 00:00:56,140 --> 00:00:59,069 This is dog’s business. 14 00:00:59,070 --> 00:01:03,139 And they have set up immigration department. 15 00:01:03,140 --> 00:01:06,139 But it is a dog’s business, watchdog. 16 00:01:06,140 --> 00:01:11,489 I say it is watchdog’s business. 17 00:01:11,490 --> 00:01:17,219 A first-class gentleman is being searched out pocket, whether you have got revolver. 18 00:01:17,220 --> 00:01:22,339 Cannot be trusted, all these educated rogues and thieves. 19 00:01:22,340 --> 00:01:24,079 So what is this advancement of civilization? 20 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:26,259 It is civilization? 21 00:01:26,260 --> 00:01:31,659 No sober man, no intelligent man, all cats and dogs, thieves, rogues. 22 00:01:31,660 --> 00:01:33,974 Is that civilization? 23 00:01:33,975 --> 00:01:45,099 It is not civilization. 24 00:01:45,100 --> 00:01:47,091 PARAMAHAṀSA: The question I have Prabhupāda is that, 25 00:01:47,092 --> 00:01:51,038 before, before scientific advancement, many people would listen to, 26 00:01:51,039 --> 00:01:53,016 like, scriptural knowledge. 27 00:01:53,017 --> 00:01:54,269 That means śūdras. 28 00:01:54,270 --> 00:01:55,752 That I have already said. 29 00:01:55,753 --> 00:01:57,909 But now they listen more to scientists. 30 00:01:57,910 --> 00:01:59,623 That means śūdra. 31 00:01:59,624 --> 00:02:07,169 Śūdras are interested to hear from śūdra. 32 00:02:07,170 --> 00:02:10,929 For example in the Bible they quote that the world is flat. 33 00:02:10,930 --> 00:02:13,519 So therefore when they found out the world is round, they say, 34 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:16,089 - “Oh, scripture is false.” - Yes. 35 00:02:16,090 --> 00:02:18,859 Scientists, they’ve proven the truth that the world is round. 36 00:02:18,860 --> 00:02:21,804 - Therefore scientists… - That must be, therefore 37 00:02:21,805 --> 00:02:25,875 the scriptures must be transcendental. 38 00:02:25,876 --> 00:02:32,324 Nonsense scripture, and people become nonsense. 39 00:02:32,325 --> 00:02:35,081 So except Vedic literature, all nonsense scripture. 40 00:02:35,082 --> 00:02:36,344 They are not scripture. 41 00:02:36,345 --> 00:02:37,941 Manufactured. 42 00:02:37,942 --> 00:02:41,381 This Bible was manufactured by this saint, this saint, 43 00:02:41,382 --> 00:02:44,442 that, according to their imagination. 44 00:02:44,443 --> 00:02:51,981 It was not spoken by Lord Jesus Christ. 45 00:02:51,982 --> 00:02:56,631 What was spoken by Jesus Christ, that they ignore: “Thou shalt not kill.” 46 00:02:56,632 --> 00:03:00,331 They kill. 47 00:03:00,332 --> 00:03:07,901 Nobody is following Christian principle; neither Bible is perfect. 48 00:03:07,902 --> 00:03:14,230 But that [indistinct] if we say we will be shot. 49 00:03:14,231 --> 00:03:16,911 - That’s what they do now in the Vietnam. - Yes. 50 00:03:16,912 --> 00:03:18,563 For God they are killing. 51 00:03:18,564 --> 00:03:19,971 Huh? 52 00:03:19,972 --> 00:03:22,550 One of the reasons that the Vietnamese war was beginning 53 00:03:22,551 --> 00:03:26,264 was because Communists, being atheists, it was a fight between 54 00:03:26,265 --> 00:03:27,784 the theists and the atheists. 55 00:03:27,785 --> 00:03:29,151 This was an excuse given. 56 00:03:29,152 --> 00:03:29,735 Yes. 57 00:03:29,736 --> 00:03:33,276 But that, that is quite all right. 58 00:03:33,277 --> 00:03:36,831 We also prepare to kill atheists. 59 00:03:36,832 --> 00:03:38,520 But preach first. 60 00:03:38,521 --> 00:03:39,511 Yes. 61 00:03:39,512 --> 00:03:43,321 - They don’t preach. - That is, killing is also preaching. 62 00:03:43,322 --> 00:03:48,311 If I kill your ignorance, that is also killing. 63 00:03:48,312 --> 00:03:50,981 That is also killing. 64 00:03:50,982 --> 00:04:09,771 Not… Killing does not mean that everyone has to take the sword. 65 00:04:09,772 --> 00:04:12,861 A new method of warfare. 66 00:04:12,862 --> 00:04:18,551 Yes, it is always there. 67 00:04:18,552 --> 00:04:22,187 By argument, by knowledge. 68 00:04:22,188 --> 00:04:33,661 SVARŪPA DĀMODARA: It’s a little wet. 69 00:04:33,662 --> 00:04:36,671 Śrīla Prabhupāda, when you are not present with us, 70 00:04:36,672 --> 00:04:45,311 how is it possible to receive instructions, for example, on questions that may arise? 71 00:04:45,312 --> 00:04:49,281 Well, the questions and answers are there in my books. 72 00:04:49,282 --> 00:04:52,901 Other than that, for example, that we would ask you in… 73 00:04:52,902 --> 00:04:55,772 Yes. 74 00:04:55,773 --> 00:04:58,081 Do you direct us also through the heart? 75 00:04:58,082 --> 00:05:07,641 - Besides the Paramātmā? - If your heart is pure. 76 00:05:07,642 --> 00:05:15,759 Everything depends on purity. 77 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:16,990 What is this? 78 00:05:16,991 --> 00:05:20,610 Sacrificial arena? 79 00:05:20,611 --> 00:05:23,105 For children, I think. 80 00:05:23,106 --> 00:05:23,876 [indistinct]? 81 00:05:23,877 --> 00:05:35,601 For cooking, yeah. 82 00:05:35,602 --> 00:05:39,071 How people are kept into ignorance. 83 00:05:39,072 --> 00:05:57,075 Life is so valuable, and they are wasting time in that way. 84 00:05:57,076 --> 00:06:03,057 Life is valuable, how life should be utilized, what is the object of life, 85 00:06:03,058 --> 00:06:08,429 they do not know anything. 86 00:06:08,430 --> 00:06:11,508 - Without knowing that the, or soul is eternal. - Huh? 87 00:06:11,509 --> 00:06:14,437 - Without knowing, - Yes. - That the soul is eternal, 88 00:06:14,438 --> 00:06:18,501 - Everybody would be acting like this. - Yes. 89 00:06:18,502 --> 00:06:22,721 That is… Bodily concept of life means animal life. 90 00:06:22,722 --> 00:06:29,371 The animal does not know. 91 00:06:29,372 --> 00:06:31,731 sa eva go-kharaḥ [SB 10.84.13] 92 00:06:31,732 --> 00:06:32,301 Go-kharaḥ. 93 00:06:32,302 --> 00:06:35,851 Go means cows, and kharaḥ means ass. 94 00:06:35,852 --> 00:06:46,871 One who is in the, under bodily concept of life, he is no better than animals. 95 00:06:46,872 --> 00:06:53,981 So when the animal talks of knowledge, an intelligent man laughs. 96 00:06:53,982 --> 00:06:55,951 That is our position. 97 00:06:55,952 --> 00:07:13,191 The animals, they are talking of knowledge. 98 00:07:13,192 --> 00:07:15,546 At least, the animals live by certain codes. 99 00:07:15,547 --> 00:07:16,383 Aha. 100 00:07:16,384 --> 00:07:18,391 At least, the animals live by certain codes. 101 00:07:18,392 --> 00:07:20,903 They do not, they do not kill unless necessary. 102 00:07:20,904 --> 00:07:23,943 - They, they only eat when necessary, - Yes 103 00:07:23,944 --> 00:07:28,974 whereas man, he kills unnecessarily, eats unnecessarily. 104 00:07:28,975 --> 00:07:31,971 So forgetting God, we are even lower than animals. 105 00:07:31,972 --> 00:07:34,372 Yes. 106 00:07:34,373 --> 00:07:44,221 Therefore we suffer also, more than the animals. 107 00:07:44,222 --> 00:07:50,611 So Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not a bogus religious sentimental movement. 108 00:07:50,612 --> 00:07:59,812 It is a scientific movement. 109 00:07:59,813 --> 00:08:05,371 So now it is up to you to prove this. 110 00:08:05,372 --> 00:08:16,901 Then you will be actually Kṛṣṇa conscious. [break] 111 00:08:16,902 --> 00:08:22,871 So they’re saying that everything in the universe is just happening by chance. 112 00:08:22,872 --> 00:08:26,919 - Eh? - Just by chance. 113 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:31,121 So you are writing book by chance. 114 00:08:31,122 --> 00:08:34,330 Then what is the value of your book? 115 00:08:34,331 --> 00:08:35,831 KARANDHARA: The book is also by chance. 116 00:08:35,832 --> 00:08:36,316 Yes. 117 00:08:36,317 --> 00:08:39,781 So everyone can write chance, so what is your credit? 118 00:08:39,782 --> 00:08:42,065 Anything nonsense can be written. 119 00:08:42,066 --> 00:08:43,311 Monod is his name. 120 00:08:43,312 --> 00:08:45,195 He got Nobel Prize in 1965 from… 121 00:08:45,196 --> 00:08:48,511 [indistinct] …Frenchman, physiologist. 122 00:08:48,512 --> 00:08:57,451 And his, chance and necessity about life, he said everything started by chance. 123 00:08:57,452 --> 00:09:02,191 So he is saying that by chance these chemicals combined together, 124 00:09:02,192 --> 00:09:05,271 forming these molecules, the basic molecules… 125 00:09:05,272 --> 00:09:09,441 But wherefrom the molecules came? 126 00:09:09,442 --> 00:09:10,941 According to him it is simply by chance. 127 00:09:10,942 --> 00:09:12,675 Chance. [indistinct] 128 00:09:12,676 --> 00:09:13,942 So everything is chance. 129 00:09:13,943 --> 00:09:19,131 So what is the necessity of your writing book? 130 00:09:19,132 --> 00:09:23,747 Then necessity arises, so these molecules re-orient, 131 00:09:23,748 --> 00:09:27,102 change as a fashion, because of necessity. 132 00:09:27,103 --> 00:09:27,573 Why? 133 00:09:27,574 --> 00:09:32,202 If everything is by chance, [indistinct] …necessity? 134 00:09:32,203 --> 00:09:34,159 What is the meaning? 135 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:36,012 Let the chance take place. 136 00:09:36,013 --> 00:09:40,482 Why necessity? 137 00:09:40,483 --> 00:09:43,886 - He is hoping for another Nobel Prize, - Huh? - by his chance. 138 00:09:43,887 --> 00:09:49,787 - Huh? - He is hoping, he is hoping for another Nobel Prize by his chance. 139 00:09:49,788 --> 00:09:51,232 All fools’ paradise. 140 00:09:51,233 --> 00:10:16,672 That’s all. 141 00:10:16,673 --> 00:10:20,462 Why do they send their children to school? 142 00:10:20,463 --> 00:10:37,192 Why not let them grow by chance? 143 00:10:37,193 --> 00:10:43,952 Is there any excuse if I say, “By chance I have violated this rule?” 144 00:10:43,953 --> 00:10:46,877 Is that the cause of excuse? 145 00:10:46,878 --> 00:10:48,852 That’s because of my ignorance. 146 00:10:48,853 --> 00:10:49,522 That is chance. 147 00:10:49,523 --> 00:10:50,192 That is chance. 148 00:10:50,193 --> 00:10:54,702 Because I am ignorant, therefore there is chance. 149 00:10:54,703 --> 00:10:58,692 It would be just as stupid as saying that a car is made by chance. 150 00:10:58,693 --> 00:10:59,537 Huh? 151 00:10:59,538 --> 00:11:03,615 It would just be as stupid as saying that a beautiful instrument like a car 152 00:11:03,616 --> 00:11:06,470 - was made by chance. - Yes, chance. 153 00:11:06,471 --> 00:11:07,682 Yes. 154 00:11:07,683 --> 00:11:15,662 That is the most regrettable condition, that these rascals are getting recognition; 155 00:11:15,663 --> 00:11:27,752 talking all foolish, and they are getting recognition. 156 00:11:27,753 --> 00:11:28,658 It’s so strange. 157 00:11:28,659 --> 00:11:30,142 When I read that book. 158 00:11:30,143 --> 00:11:32,993 He defines the difference between the living and the non-living 159 00:11:32,994 --> 00:11:35,980 by a term called teleonomy. 160 00:11:35,981 --> 00:11:37,972 T E L E O N O M Y. 161 00:11:37,973 --> 00:11:43,552 I tried to find out in the dictionary and I couldn’t find any word like that. 162 00:11:43,553 --> 00:11:48,742 - But I understood that what he meant was… - Hyperfoorascal. 163 00:11:48,743 --> 00:11:56,982 KṚṢṆA−KĀNTĪ: He invents his own word jugglery. 164 00:11:56,983 --> 00:11:58,786 He was trying to present the difference 165 00:11:58,787 --> 00:12:02,797 between the organic beings and the non-organic beings. 166 00:12:02,798 --> 00:12:07,837 So he goes in such a round about fashion just to differentiate. 167 00:12:07,838 --> 00:12:09,502 Petitio Principii. [Circular reasoning] 168 00:12:09,503 --> 00:12:13,442 This logic is called Petitio Principii. [Circular reasoning] 169 00:12:13,443 --> 00:12:26,765 He has to prove something, but he is taking his premises from that something. 170 00:12:26,766 --> 00:12:26,767 Subtitles by Pratyatoṣa Dāsa, Causelessmercy.com