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RC NY 1976-07-11 Can God Directly Talk to Man
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ANNOUNCER: Next
is a conversation
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with His Divine Grace
A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda,
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recorded on July 11th,
1976, in New York.
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INDIAN MAN: Why, how the caste
system has crippled our society so much,
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- was accepted by…
- SRILA PRABHUPADA: Wrongly
- wrongly.
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Kṛṣṇa says,
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cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ
guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ
[Bg. 4.13]
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So according to quality
and work… That is fact.
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If you have got engineering qualification
and if you can work as engineer,
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people will call you
engineer-sāheb.
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Is it not?
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So there may be a class of engineer,
but that depends on quality and work.
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But if you have no quality, no
work, how you become engineer?
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If you have no qualification
of becoming an engineer,
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and you do not work,
you work as a clerk,
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and if somebody addresses
you “Engineer-sāheb,”
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he is a fool, you are a fool.
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So if he’s not a brāhmaṇa,
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if you call him a brāhmaṇa, then
you are fool and he is also fool.
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So that is going
on, fools’ paradise.
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A rascal who is not in
qualification a brāhmaṇa,
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if he’s addressed and given
honor of a brāhmaṇa, he’s sees,
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“Oh, for nothing I am getting this
honor, that’s right, very nice.”
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And who is giving him honor
as brāhmaṇa, he’s also rascal.
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But it is not that.
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cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ
guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ
[Bg. 4.13]
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Not by birth.
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One must acquire the
quality of a brāhmaṇa.
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śaucaṁ samaḥ damaḥ
titikṣa ārjavam
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jñānaṁ vijñānam āstikyaṁ
brahma-karma svabhāva-jam
[Bg. 18.42]
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He must be truthful, he
must be self-restrained,
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self-controlled, full of
knowledge, very simple.
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All these qualifications, when he
acquires, then he becomes a brāhmaṇa.
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No, even in the Rāmāyaṇa
and Mahābhārata,
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we find this kind of…
Ekalavya was discriminated,
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- Karṇa was discriminated…
- Because he was not accustomed
to the practice of brāhmaṇa.
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One must be brāhmaṇa
by practice; that is wanted.
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This is a kind of
discrimination though.
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- Hmm?
- This is kind of discrimination though.
- Yes.
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Kṛṣṇa says,
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māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya
ye ’pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ
[Bg 9.32]
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Never mind if he’s born
in low-grade family,
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but he’s eligible to go back
to home, back to Godhead.
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te ’pi yānti parāṁ gatim
[Bg 9.32]
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Do you mean to say, unless one
becomes a first-class brāhmaṇa,
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he can go back to home, back to
God… No, that is not possible.
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So,
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kirāta-hūṇāndhra-pulinda-pulkaśā
ābhīra-śumbhā yavanāḥ… śudhyanti
[SB 2.4.18]
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The purificatory process… Just
like these Europeans, Americans,
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they are being recognized as brāhmaṇas
because they are pure devotees.
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That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu’s
mission, He says,
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kṛṣṇa-bhajane nāhi jāti-kulādi-vicāra
[Cc. Antya 4.67]
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Kṛṣṇa-bhajane, if one becomes Kṛṣṇa
conscious, there is no such discrimination,
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even if you make that, because as
soon as you become Kṛṣṇa conscious,
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you become the best brāhmaṇa.
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That is also stated in
the Bhagavad-gītā.
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sa guṇān samatītyaitān
brahma-bhūyāya kalpate
[Bg. 14.26]
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He immediately becomes
on the brahma platform.
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And brāhmaṇa means
one who knows brahma.
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brahma jānāti iti brāhmaṇa
[Manu Smriti]
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So every devotee,
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if he’s purely engaged in devotional
service, he’s more than brāhmaṇa.
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And so-called brāhmaṇa, without Kṛṣṇa
consciousness, that is not recognized.
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avaiṣṇavo gurur na syād
vaiṣṇavaḥ śva-paco guruḥ
[Padma Purāṇa]
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If a dog-eater, caṇḍāla, he has
become a Vaiṣṇava, he can be guru.
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But a brāhmaṇa…
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ṣaṭ-karma-nipuṇo vipro
mantra-tantra-viśāradaḥ
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avaiṣṇavo gurur na syāt
[Padma Purāṇa]
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If he’s expert, Vedic chanting and
everything, mantra-tantra-viśārada,
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but if he’s not a Vaiṣṇava,
he cannot become guru.
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So according to our Caitanya
Mahāprabhu’s… That is actually,
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according to Vedic injunction.
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If you understand Kṛṣṇa, then you
become more than a brāhmaṇa.
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Try to understand Kṛṣṇa, and
then your life is successful.
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And Kṛṣṇa is being
distributed by Lord Kṛṣṇa.
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Not only He’s giving Kṛṣṇa,
He’s giving kṛṣṇa-prema,
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kṛṣṇa-prema-pradāya te
kṛṣṇāya kṛṣṇa-caitanya-
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nāmne gaura-tviṣe namaḥ
[Madhya 19.53]
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Caitanya Mahāprabhu is so kind,
merciful, He’s not only giving Kṛṣṇa,
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He’s giving kṛṣṇa-prema,
which is very, very rare. [splice]
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Find out that, when Lord
Buddha appeared, that verse.
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sammohāya sura-dviṣām
[SB 1.3.24]
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His propaganda was to cheat
the atheist class of men.
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Atheist class of men,
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they did not recognize existence of
God, so He became one of them.
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sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam
[Daśāvatāra Stotra 7]
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This atheist class, they were killing animals
in the name of yajña like anything.
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So, yadā yadā hi dharmasya
glānir bhavati [Bg. 4.7]
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so He came as Buddha to
stop this animal killing.
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His real business was
stop the animal killing,
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that these rascals are going to
hell, in the name of religion,
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so at least stop their
activities of animal killing.
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So therefore he started the mission, ahiṁsā
paramo dharma: “Don’t kill animals.”
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But in the Vedas there is
recommendation, in the yajña,
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as you were saying, that there is…,
animal killing is recommended.
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So people presented that, “Here is animal
killing recommended in the yajña.”
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Therefore he denied
the authority of Vedas.
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nindasi yajña-vidher ahaha śruti-jātaṁ
sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam
[Daśāvatāra Stotra 7]
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So this Buddha incarnation is
cheating the atheist class of men.
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He said that “Don’t kill animals.
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If you are killed you feel pain,
why you should kill animals?”
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That was his mission, to stop
animal killing, sinful activities.
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So what was your question?
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I just asked why he has preached
impersonal form of God.
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Yes, because they were all godless,
so he said, “There is no God,
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but you stop this animal killing.”
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That was his mission.
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And he said, “There is no God,
but whatever I say, you accept.”
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So they agreed.
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But he is God, that is cheating.
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Superficially he said there
is no God, but he is God.
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Somehow or other, if people stop
animal killing and accept Lord Buddha,
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then he becomes at least one
step forward to God realization.
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So in a cheating process
he made good to others.
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DHṚṢṬADYUMNA:
Tataḥ kalau sampravṛtte
sammohāya sura-dviṣām
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buddho nāmnāñjana-sutaḥ
kīkaṭeṣu bhaviṣyati
[SB 1.3.24]
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Translation.
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“Then in the beginning of Kali-yuga,
the Lord will appear as Lord Buddha,
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the son of Añjanā, in
the province of Gayā,
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just for the purpose of deluding those
who are envious of the faithful theists.”
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To delude them.
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Read the purport.
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“Lord Buddha, a powerful incarnation
of the Personality of Godhead,
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appeared in the province of Gayā
(Bihar) as the son of Añjanā,
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and he preached his own
conception of nonviolence,
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and deprecated even the animal
sacrifices sanctioned in the Vedas.
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At the time when Lord Buddha appeared,
the people in general were atheistic
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and preferred animal
flesh to anything else.
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On the plea of Vedic sacrifice,
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every place was practically
turned into a slaughterhouse,
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and animal killing was
indulged in unrestrictedly.
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Lord Buddha preached nonviolence,
taking pity on the poor animals.
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He preached that he did not
believe in the tenets of the Vedas,
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and stressed the adverse psychological
effects incurred by animal killing.
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Less intelligent men
of the age of Kali,
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who had no faith in God,
followed his principle,
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and for the time being they were trained
in moral discipline and nonviolence,
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the preliminary steps for proceeding
further on the path of God realization.
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He deluded the atheists
because such atheists,
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who followed his principles
did not believe in God,
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but they kept their absolute
faith in Lord Buddha,
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who himself was the
incarnation of God.
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Thus the faithless people were made to
believe in God in the form of Lord Buddha.
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That was the mercy of Lord Buddha:
he made the faithless, faithful to Him.
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Killing of animals before
the advent of Lord Buddha,
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was the most prominent
feature of the society.
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They claimed that these
were Vedic sacrifices.
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When the Vedas were not accepted
through authoritative disciplic succession,
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the casual readers of
the Vedas are misled,
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by the flowery language of
that system of knowledge.
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In the Bhagavad-gītā, a comment has
been made on such foolish scholars.
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The foolish scholars of Vedic
literature who do not care
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to receive the
transcendental message,
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through the transcendental realized
sources of disciplic succession,
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are sure to be bewildered.
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To them, the ritualistic ceremonies
are considered to be all in all.
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They have no depth of knowledge.
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According to Bhagavad-gītā,
the whole system of the Vedas,
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is to lead one gradually to the
path of the Supreme Lord.
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The whole theme of Vedic literature
is to know the Supreme Lord,
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the individual soul, the cosmic situation
and the relations between all these items.
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When the relation is known,
the relative function begins,
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and as a result of such a
function, the ultimate goal of life,
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or going back to Godhead, takes
place in the easiest manner.
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Unfortunately, unauthorized
scholars of the Vedas,
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become captivated by the
purificatory ceremonies only,
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and natural progress
is checked thereby.
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To such bewildered persons
of atheistic propensity,
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Lord Buddha is the
emblem of theism.
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He therefore first of all wanted to
check the habit of animal killing.
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The animal killers are dangerous elements
on the path of going back to Godhead.
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00:14:01,631 --> 00:14:03,763
There are two types
of animal killers.
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The soul is also sometimes called
the animal, or the living being.
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00:14:08,084 --> 00:14:10,692
Therefore both the
slaughterers of animals,
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as well as those who have lost their
identity of the soul, are animal killers.
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Mahārāja Parīkṣit said that only
the animal killer cannot relish,
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the transcendental message
of the Supreme Lord.
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Therefore if people are to be
educated on the path of Godhead,
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they must be taught
first and foremost,
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to stop the process of animal
killing as above mentioned.
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It is nonsensical to say that animal killing
has nothing to do with spiritual realization.
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By this dangerous theory
many so-called sannyāsīs,
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00:14:43,938 --> 00:14:46,577
have sprung up by
the grace of Kali-yuga,
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to preach animal killing
under the garb of the Vedas.”
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Now there are so many rascals in this
dress of sannyāsī, they are eating meat.
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That is going on.
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They say, “What is the
wrong of eating meat?
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Can eat.”
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They eat meat.
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Then?
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“The subject matter has already
been discussed in the conversation
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between Lord Caitanya and
Maulana Chand Kazi Shaheb.
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The animal sacrifice as stated in the
Vedas is different from the unrestricted
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- animal killing in the slaughterhouse.”
- There, your question.
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“Because the asuras,
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- or the so-called scholars of Vedic literatures…”
- Now you were referring to the Vedic principle,
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but that does not mean you
have to open slaughterhouse.
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But these rascals are
opening slaughterhouse.
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You think it is Vedic principle?
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Suppose it is recommended that
animals should be sacrificed,
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in the Vedic ritualistic ceremony.
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Does it mean that you shall
open regular slaughterhouse?
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Just as the Christians say
that Jesus Christ ate fish,
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therefore they are right in
opening big, big slaughterhouse?
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Maybe Lord Jesus Christ ate fish,
in some awkward circumstances,
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but that does not mean that he is
recommending to open slaughterhouse.
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In the Ten Commandments
he says, “Thou shalt not kill.”
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When there is absolute necessity, there
is no other food, that is another thing,
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but if there is sufficient other
foodstuff, why should you kill?
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They are not even human being,
those who are animal killers.
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vinā paśughnāt
[SB 10.1.4]
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All those who are animal killers,
they are not even human being,
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what to speak of religious system.
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Nivṛtta-tarṣair upagīyamānād
bhavauṣadhāc chrotra-mano-’bhirāmāt
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ka uttamaśloka… [SB 10.1.4]
If you are animal killer, your,
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God consciousness is finished.
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You’ll never be able to
understand what is God.
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Then your life is finished.
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This life is meant for understanding
God, and if you are animal killer,
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then your God
understanding is finished.
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May I ask a question, Prabhupāda?
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Something that I’ve wondered about,
perhaps you could explain it briefly.
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I believe that Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme
God, so don’t get me wrong,
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but since you mentioned Christ,
was he an incarnation of Kṛṣṇa?
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- Was Jesus Christ sent here by Kṛṣṇa from…
- He said that he is son of God;
that is accepted. [splice]
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Subtitles by Gopī Kāntā Dāsa, Causelessmercy.com