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RC NY 1976-07-11 Christ-Our Guru
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ANNOUNCER: Next
is a conversation
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with His Divine Grace
A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda,
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recorded on July 11th,
1976, in New York.
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INDIAN MAN (7): Swamiji,
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how could you convince these Christian
people that Christ was the son of God,
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or Kṛṣṇa was the…
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PRABHUPĀDA: Christ says
himself that “I am son of God.”
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Many Christians, they do not…
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Many Christians also…
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There are so many
Christian editions.
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That is another thing.
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BALI−MARDANA:
We have accepted.
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But all these Christians,
they all my students,
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they are coming from Christian.
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How they accept
Kṛṣṇa as the father?
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GUEST (1): Prabhupāda, did Christ
return to the spiritual planets then,
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when he left the earth,
to be with Kṛṣṇa?
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He is coming from
spiritual planets.
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He is authorized
representative of Kṛṣṇa.
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We accept him as
śaktyāveśa-avatāra.
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So I was invited in some priestly meeting
in Melbourne, they asked me the question,
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“What is your opinion of Christ?”
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So I said “He’s our guru.”
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Actually, we accept
him as our guru.
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He’s preaching God’s
message; he’s Vaiṣṇava.
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Anyone who accepts
God, he’s Vaiṣṇava.
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He was explaining
kingdom of God, God.
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So according to
time, circumstances,
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audience…
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Now we can just imagine what
kind of people he had to deal with,
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that his commandment
is “Thou shall not kill.”
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Then understand how much
they were accustomed to killing.
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So what kind of men they were?
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And not only that, in spite of hearing
his instruction “Thou shall not kill,”
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they killed him first.
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So what kind of men
they were, just imagine.
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He said, “Thou shall not kill,” and
they decided, “We shall kill you first.”
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So this class of men
he had to deal with.
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What would happen to the people
that killed Christ on the cross?
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Very bad, it seems.
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Christ cannot be killed,
but they killed themselves.
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DEVOTEE (3): So we read that Christ
said “I and my father are one,”
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so they say therefore Christ is Kṛṣṇa,
so therefore Kṛṣṇa can’t be God.
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“One” means in quality.
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And in the Vedic literature
we say ahaṁ brahmāsmi.
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That means we are one in quality.
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brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
[Bg. 18.54]
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So now we are material-
bhūtaḥ, jīva-bhūtaḥ.
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When we realize that
“I am not this body.
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I am spirit soul, I am part and parcel
of God,” that is brahma-bhūtaḥ.
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Then bhakti begins.
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brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
na śocati na kāṅkṣati
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samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu
mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām
[Bg. 18.54]
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Then he enters into Vaikuṇṭha,
after Brahman realization.
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So Lord Buddha’s finished?
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- DHṚṢṬADYUMNA: No.
- Go on, finish it.
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“The animal sacrifice
as stated in the Vedas
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is different from the unrestricted
animal killing in the slaughterhouse.
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Because the asuras or the so-
called scholars of Vedic literatures
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put forward the evidence of
animal killing in the Vedas,
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Lord Buddha superficially denied
the authority of the Vedas.
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This rejection of the Vedas by
Lord Buddha was adopted…”
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Just like, you said that in the Vedas
there is animal killing… [splice]
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…instead of wasting his time he
said “I don’t care for your Vedas.
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It is my order that you
stop if you love me.”
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You cannot open slaughterhouse
giving reference to the Vedas,
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or any sacrifice either.
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The Jews, and everyone, the
Muhammadans, they also make sacrifice.
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One day in the year…
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One day in the year they sacrifice.
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It’s not that they recommend
open a slaughterhouse.
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This is all nonsense, rākṣasa.
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That sacrifice also recommended in this
sense, that you cannot stop animal killing,
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there will be a class of men who will eat
meat—to give them some concession.
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So this is recommended, “All right, if
you want to eat meat, you sacrifice.”
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Amongst the Hindus, just like Kālī-
pūjā, Durgā-pūjā, the animal eaters,
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they are given this concession,
that “If you want to eat meat,
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you just worship Goddess Kālī,”
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and this goddess Kālī-worshiping
is recommended on the amāvasyā,
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on the dark moon night, one day
in a month, at the dead of night.
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So if one goes on eating meat in this way,
one day in a month and dead of night,
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then he’ll automatically give it up.
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“So much botheration,
better give it up.”
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Actually deny.
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“Yes, you can eat once in a
month at the dead of night,
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when everyone will sleep, nobody can
hear the screaming of the animal…”
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These are the recommendations.
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That is indirectly denying.
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If one is intelligent, he’ll accept it, “Why
so much botheration for eating meat?
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Better give it up.”
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INDIAN MAN (4): Śrīla Prabhupāda,
there are so many gurus…
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We are not talking of so many
gurus, we are talking of real guru,
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- that’s all, real guru.
- Preaching Buddhism.
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Real guru is he who talks in
disciplic succession of Kṛṣṇa.
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evaṁ paramparā-prāptam
imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ
[Bg. 4.2]
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That is guru.
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The bumifor guru is no guru.
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avaiṣṇavo gurur na syāt
[Padma Purāṇa]
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Anyone who is not
Vaiṣṇava, he’s not guru.
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First, He says in the
Bhagavad-gītā, Bhagavān,
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ya idaṁ paramaṁ guhyaṁ
mad-bhakteṣv abhidhāsyati
[Bg 18.68]
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Find out this.
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He is guru, who is preaching
what Kṛṣṇa has taught, he is guru.
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Not that anyone and
everyone becomes a guru.
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If you want to be cheated by such
rascal guru, that is your business,
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but who is guru, that is
stated in the Bhagavad-gītā.
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Anyone who preaches the
teachings of Kṛṣṇa, he is guru.
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Caitanya Mahāprabhu also says,
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āmāra ājñāya guru hañā tāra’ei deśa
[Cc. Madhya 7.128]
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“You become a guru on My order.”
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“How shall I become guru?
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I have no knowledge.”
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Oh, you don’t require any
knowledge to manufacture.
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yāre dekha tāre kaha ‘kṛṣṇa’-upadeśa
[Cc. Madhya 7.128]
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“Simply repeat the instruction
of Kṛṣṇa, you become guru.”
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Everyone can become.
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The instruction is there.
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Kṛṣṇa says:
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sarva-dharmān parityajya
mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja
[Bg. 18.66]
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We say the same thing.
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Not that “I have
become Kṛṣṇa not…”
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We say “Surrender to Kṛṣṇa.”
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Then you become guru.
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Kṛṣṇa’s instruction,
not to become Kṛṣṇa.
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If you want to become Kṛṣṇa, then
you are not guru, you are cheater.
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Suppose you are
working for master.
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If you say “My master has fixed up
this price; you cannot change it,”
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then you are honest salesman.
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And if you place yourself that “I am
the master,” then you are cheater.
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The cheater cannot be teacher.
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Teacher is he who simply teaches
what Kṛṣṇa has said, that’s all.
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He is teacher.
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That is not difficult;
anyone can do it.
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Therefore Caitanya
Mahāprabhu says,
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yāre dekha tāre kaha ‘kṛṣṇa’-upadeśa
[Cc. Madhya 7.128]
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Whomever you meet, you simply
speak to him the instruction of Kṛṣṇa.
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Then you become guru.
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And if you don’t say that, if you
manufacture your own words,
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then you are cheater,
you are not teacher.
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The so-called gurus,
they’re cheaters.
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They want to become Kṛṣṇa.
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Therefore they are cheater.
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And it is very easy thing if
you cheat people, that…
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“You take this mantra
and you become God.”
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Is God, so easy thing
to become God?
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But they want to be cheated.
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“Purchasing mantra,
I shall become God.”
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They want to be cheated.
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They do not think that…
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“Whether I can
actually become God.”
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They do not take the
weight of His existence.
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- Hare Kṛṣṇa.
- Jaya.
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So what is the time now?
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PUṢṬA KṚṢṆA: Eight
o’clock, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
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- DEVOTEES: Jaya!
- Thank you Srila Prabhupada!
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