Room Conversation Prabhupada: “…American,’’ “I am Indian,’’ “I am this,’’ “I am that.’’ Hm. Devotee (1): Did you have some places to see down in, ah, for Prabhupada to see in the next day or two? Dhananjaya: There’s this one big church I went to see in Hammersmith, and I thought he could see… (devotees conversing in background) Prabhupada: Where is Himavati? Devotee (2) (Hamsaduta?): She’s… I think she’s upstairs in the… (more devotee conversation in background) Devotee (1): There is one very large church to see on Monday. Prabhupada: Monday. Devotee (1): Yeah. Not before. Prabhupada: Why not before? Dhananjaya: Well, we can arrange for this week also a church. Prabhupada: Where it is? Dhananjaya: It’s in Hammersmith, Hammersmith. Prabhupada: How far? Dhananjaya: From here its about five miles, four or five miles. Devotee (1): It’s, ah, towards the airport. Prabhupada: Towards the airport. So not bad. Devotee (1): Not bad. No, it’s still downtown. Dhananjaya: It’s on the motorway. It’s very near to the motorway, the motorway coming from the airport into central London. Prabhupada: So why not see earlier? Have you got any description? Dhananjaya: Well, we can’t see it earlier because it belongs to the Methodist Church, and their committee members are meeting in another city, in Manchester, for a week. They have their…, a big congress meeting there. So they don’t come back until the end of this week. Devotee (1): So we can’t see it while they’re meeting? Dhananjaya: Well we could see it from the outside. Actually we went there one day, Mr. Allen(?) and (indistinct) and myself. Prabhupada: Well, what is the description? Dhananjaya: It’s very nice. It’s something like, ah, something like the size of this temple but bigger. Devotee (2): Bigger than Los Angeles? Dhananjaya: And also it has a steeple. Prabhupada: Bigger, bigger. What is the price? Dhananjaya: Oh, more than 250,000 pounds. Devotee (2): Quarter of a million pounds. Two lakhs of pounds. Devotee (1): So that’s six million dollars? Dhananjaya: No, one million. One million dollars. Prabhupada: You have got? Devotee (2): No, it’s not a million dollars. It’s only 600,000. Dhananjaya: Well they said between 250,000 and 350,000 pounds. Devotee (2): Oh, the money, the money won’t be as important as the place. If we get the place, we can get the money, I think. Dhananjaya: But still there is a congregation. It’s not available immediately. Prabhupada: Oh. Dhananjaya: There’s a congregation there still. Devotee (Revatinandana?): You have no idea when it would be available? Devotee (2): Tomorrow I will go out, some of the others will go out, we’ll find some places to look at for you. I have some friends, we’ll all go see them. Prabhupada: So what do you think of this Dr. Sar? As he speaks, it is all right, do you think? Does he speak more than what he is? Devotee: Is he trustworthy? Dhananjaya: Yes, he speaks more than what he is. Prabhupada: Oh. Devotee (Revatinandana?): Yes. I, I, I don’t like him very much. I, I don’t know what his motive is, you know. I don’t think his motive is strictly very much…, you know? Dhananjaya: He approached me and he said… I was talking about life members to him, saying, “Why shouldn’t it be one hundred pounds? This is a good price for life members.’’ And he said, “Well, fifty-one pounds, this is the value of one hundred(?) rupees.’’ He said, “I am prepared to give fifty-one pounds.’’ Then he said, “Actually, I have given already more than than fifty-one pounds. I have given Krsna’s jewelry, so why you don’t make me life member?’’ And I said, “But you have not asked.’’ And he said, “But I have given at least…” Devotee (2): Make him life member. He’s given all the jewelry. Prabhupada: Is he a very influential man? Dhananjaya: What’s the definition of influential man? Prabhupada: Or he’s not very… He talks? Dhananjaya: He talks a bit about his community, but he’s not produced anything for this community. He’s produced some money for the jewelry. This is very nice. Devotee (1): Personal money. Personal money? Dhananjaya: Not just personal money. Prabhupada: Do you think he can help us by raising funds? Dhananjaya: He can help, but I don’t think he can raise thousands and thousands and thousands. See, personally he has no money. He told me he has no money. He’s simply at his job he gets so much money. Prabhupada: And he’s working somewhere? Dhananjaya: Yes, he’s working. He’s in Oxford Street, very near. Prabhupada: And he says that he’s M.A., Ph.D.? You see? So? He says so. Dhananjaya: Yes, he’s a graduate. Devotee (1): He’s a doctorate, Ph.D.? Dhananjaya: But still not so influential. Prabhupada: Neither you are. Is he reliable? Dhananjaya: Well, he’s said so many times, “I can help, I can help.’’ But still he’s not produced anything positive. Prabhupada: This carpet was donated by him? Dhananjaya: Yes, this rug. Devotee (2): This? This has been here for years. In the beginning he did, I guess. Mukunda would know. Prabhupada: So you can ask Nanda Kumara to give me milk in that way. Devotee (2): Yes. Prabhupada: Or you can ask Himavati. What is your formula? Devotee (Revatinandana): Ginger powder and a little bit of saffron and sugar. Heat it up for a while, and then after a little while mix thoroughly and serve like that. It’s good for digestion. Prabhupada: You give to Nanda Kumara, because he will give. Revatinandana: Yeah. Prabhupada: (converses in Hindi with Indian about traveling sankirtana party in Birmingham, Cardiff) Devotee (1): She was very happy, Sumati Morarji. Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee (1): She went away very happy. Prabhupada: Everyone will be happy when you are Krsna’s devotee. You see? She’s seeing Krsna’s so many devotees. That is Krsna bhakta. Devotee (2): She said she wanted to see the Deities before leaving. Prabhupada: And she saw? Revatinandana: Two months ago she came here for most of the aratik ceremony. The devotees came out to say goodbye to her, and she said, “Go back and do aratik.” Prabhupada: She can influence the whole Bombay, she’s so… Devotee (2): Oh, she knows everyone. Dhananjaya: We need a president like her for the board of trustees for London also. Devotee: Has she had any assistance?(?) Prabhupada: Oh, yes. She is doing her best. She is nice. Devotee (1): When is Mr. (indistinct) going to come? Dhananjaya: He’s going to drive Prabhupada to Kensington tomorrow. Devotee: Tomorrow? Dhananjaya: Or Friday. Devotee (2): He can’t come before? He should come… Revatinandana: He comes almost every night actually. (more conversation) Prabhupada: And the Joshi is the manager here? Devotee (1): That’s her manager here. Prabhupada: Yes. Devotee (2): Oh, then he’s the one who should know everything. She said she would carry everything for us practically around the world… Prabhupada: Yes. Devotee (2): …on her boats. We have many mrdangas, everything… Prabhupada: Oh, yes. In Calcutta. From Calcutta, there she starts for all over the world. So simply… But Calcutta manager is rascal. Calcutta manager, that is difficult. Devotee: Why don’t we send… Why don’t we send a hundred, two hundred mrdangas to America and Europe, big shipments sometime? We really use them down through the years. Prabhupada: But I know that Calcutta manager is a (Hindi). (laughs) Revatinandana: Well, they won’t become… They have many… All the big men in the Calcutta house, they won’t become life members. None of them. I know, I approached them. No one will become life members. Prabhupada: Calcutta house? Revatinandana: That Calcutta Scindia office. There’s several big men. The one I remember is Mr. Trivedi. I don’t know if he’s the head man. Prabhupada: Trivedi. Revatinandana: Yeah. I talked to him, but he will not become a life member. He wouldn’t even give that much rupees. (laughs) Prabhupada: They are not very highly paid. Within thousand. In Japan also. The high salary is in your country. Devotee: Hm. Prabhupada: Unexpected fabulous(?) Just like that boy who came to see me yesterday. He’s in India, he’s getting 900 dollars, that means our ten thousand rupees. Gopal is also not getting. I asked Gopal to continue his service and give 400 dollars per month. Devotee (1): Hm. Each month. That’s great. Very good. Prabhupada: So here we shall give you books, cost price only, and you sell books by profit only and spend for building. Dhananjaya: Traveling Sankirtana Party is very strong here. There’s some very nice boys now. Revatinandana: They go out and they simply distribute, and just like I think in San Francisco, Kesava’s… He began it here. They just go out with literature and simply to distribute literature, you know, in that way. Prabhupada: So Kesava’s feeling not well, then he can come here. Devotee (2): He wanted to. He wanted to bring his party here. Prabhupada: He can do that. Let him do that. Write him. Revatinandana: But actually he may improve it even more. They are already a good group. They are doing all right. Prabhupada: Very expert. Not only good, very expert. Dhananjaya: They’re averaging sixty-seventy pounds a day. Prabhupada: Huh? Dhananjaya: Sixty-seventy pounds a day they’re collecting. Prabhupada: You are not collecting so much? Dhananjaya: What’s that? Prabhupada: You are not collecting so much? Dhananjaya: Here in the temple? Prabhupada: Yes. Dhananjaya: We are collecting, on Oxford Street, we’re collecting about forty, fifty pounds a day, and on travelling sankirtana, sixty, seventy pounds, because they’re doing it for more hours. So altogether we’re over a hundred pounds a day. Prabhupada: Now you are GBC here, you have come, now you make it hundred pounds daily. How to do it, he knows. Dhananjaya: But, but there is already hundred pounds coming. Two hundred pounds, then. Prabhupada: And his best friend is George. (laughs) Devotee: I’m going to see him tomorrow. Devotee (1): Is he in town? Prabhupada: He can alone make purchase a good temple. George alone can purchase. Devotee (2): He says George is in New York. Devotee: (conversation in background) Dhananjaya: Oh, he may be with Mr. Ravi Patel. I think we saw him at the airport. Prabhupada: Huh? Dhananjaya: He’s a printer, and he came in the van with you from the airport. He’s a very nice man. He’s doing printing for us. He says he has so many thousands of rupees in Bombay and in Madras from his printing. And he also wants to offer his services. I think he will come tomorrow to see you. Prabhupada: They can print our books, in Bombay. Dhananjaya: He said he wanted to offer his services here for this temple somehow or other by getting money from advertising purposes. He’s the director of some company that’s just been started. It’s called Golden Products. They make all kinds of consumer goods like shampoos and soap powders, so many things like that, for household use. And he wanted to use his symbol, Golden Products, with this society. This is his idea. Prabhupada: Golden powder? Dhananjaya: Golden Products. Prabhupada: In our society? No. Dhananjaya: I told him… Prabhupada: That is not possible. Devotee: Who is he? Dhananjaya: He went to the (indistinct). Prabhupada: Yes. There was a boy. Dhananjaya: His other idea is, he said he was working for Sai Baba, Satya Sai Baba. He said that in India he had raised so many thousands of lakhs of rupees by making posters. They are impersonal posters, so much nonsense in them, but they sold like lottery tickets. In this way he printed them and made so much money. Prabhupada: I mean he cannot suggest. We cannot accept anyone’s suggestion. Dhananjaya: Yeah. Devotee: That’s proven to be too…, too horrible. Devotee: Yes, always. Devotee (2): I saw Mr…. Who was that? What’s that man’s name who made your first record in New York? Prabhupada: Collin. Devotee (2): Ah, I saw Mr. Collin at the airport when you arrived in New York at that meeting, press meeting. Prabhupada: Oh, he was there? Devotee (2): He was there. Prabhupada: Oh, why did he not see me? Devotee (2): He didn’t come. He was a little embarrassed, I think. Prabhupada: He must be embarrassed. He’s a thief. (laughter) Desirous man never becomes happy. He did not pay me anything as royalty for the record. Devotee: Hm. Devotee (2): He’s still selling it, too. Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee (2): He’s still selling that record. Prabhupada: Yes. Must be selling and taking advantage of this Hare Krsna movement. Devotee (2): That’s a nice record. Devotee: Is that Govinda? Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee (2): That’s a very nice record. Everyone is appreciating. Prabhupada: But I heard that rascal always played my record and hear Hare Krsna. Devotee (1): At least he’s benefiting somehow. I saw him in Bombay also one day in the market of Madhubal, Madhubhag (?) temple? He was buying beads for his store in New York. Prabhupada: He’s selling beads, records, on our account. (laughter) Devotee (1): He was being cheated himself, in Bombay. He was being cheated like anything. He was paying one rupee for one strand of beads, those poor quality beads. (pause) Prabhupada: Now you can arrange for the car? Devotee: Yes. Atreya Rsi is going to be working on it, too, to raise funds. Prabhupada: So, at least two first-class car must go to India. Devotee: Cadillac? Prabhupada: Any. They must recognize, “Here the American guru is going.” Devotee: Have to get Cadillac. Prabhupada: (laughter) If the American guru has no car, he’s walking on the street, that is disgrace for you. Is it not? (laughs) And they criticize, “Oh, what kind of guru you are, you are walking on the street? You are American guru?” Devotee: I was thinking if each devotee in the United States went out… Prabhupada: You write on the car, “The Spiritual Master of USA.’’ (laughter) And people will see, “Oh, here is the spiritual…’’ (laughs) Devotee: Should we do that? “Spiritual Master of USA”? Prabhupada: Yes. Why not? (laughter) Devotee: If each of your devotees collected five dollars one day, that’s $5,000, more, more than $5,000. Prabhupada: That you… And soon as you issue letter, that will come. It is not my (indistinct) And she will carry. Make arrangement with government so that next time when I go to India, I sit on the car. That’s all. Devotee: And Gurudasa… Actually we better do it soon, because it takes two or three months. Prabhupada: Yes, so you can do. Devotee: We can talk about the details later. Prabhupada: That I am immigrant here; I’ve stayed since 1965. The embassy, everyone, knows. So I can take my cars, that there is a law. So in this way take permission from the government and you get the car and I go and drive it. That’s all. Devotee: You’ll take this car with you, Prabhupada, wherever you go? Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee: You will take this car with you wherever you go? Prabhupada: As far as possible. People will see, “The spiritual master of USA is going there.” Devotee: Supposing you want to go to Bombay. You can fly to Bombay and someone can drive the car there. And then when you’re in Bombay, you can drive it in Bombay. Prabhupada: No, you can go from Calcutta to Agra, nice road. And from Agra to Bombay. Devotee: How many days? Two days? Prabhupada: No, no. One day, two days, yes. Even if it runs fifty mile per hour, so from morning, early morning to noon, say six hours if we run, it’s three hundred miles in the morning and three hundred miles in the evening, and stay at night. And then the next day three hundred miles, three hundred…, six hundred miles. Twelve hundred miles anywhere you go from Calcutta to Bombay, Calcutta to Madras, Calcutta to Delhi, within twelve hundred miles. Within two days from anywhere to anywhere you can go. India’s length and breadth is not so wide as in your country. You have got… That is also not good roads, in your… But in Calcutta, to Calcutta-Bombay, Madras, Delhi, there are good roads. Devotee: Yeah. Prabhupada: Good roads. So we can go by road. Devotee: So we can begin campaigning right away, collecting funds for the vehicle. Prabhupada: And you are a good driver. (laughter) Eighty miles. You once at eighty miles, his father’s car. His father gave a very nice car for my driving. His father, mother, sister met me in Portland. Very nice gentleman, mother nice, sister very beautiful. Devotee: But silent. Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee: I have written to her some letters, but silence. Prabhupada: (laughs) Yes. They are not very happy that you are in this movement, not in the family, naturally. They think, “Our lost child.’’ (laughter) They cannot appreciate that “My child is lost for better purposes.’’ That is the case. Revatinandana: Actually, I wanted to ask you about something like that. When I took sannyasa in Calcutta, some time afterwards, I used to correspond with my parents. So I sent them a letter explaining what was sannyasa, and that I had taken sannyasa, and that I didn’t want to hear so much more about nieces, nephews, things like that that I have in that family. I said “If you want to talk, now we have to talk about Krsna consciousness.’’ So I didn’t hear anything from them for about six months. But just the other day I received a letter… Prabhupada: Then don’t. Now you have taken sannyasa, you don’t. Revatinandana: I shouldn’t do it at all. Prabhupada: No. Revatinandana: But she’s quite intelligent. She’s asking… Prabhupada: Your mother? Revatinandana: Yeah. …all about Krsna consciousness. She has the Gita. Prabhupada: Your mother, your mother must be intelligent because you are intelligent. Your mother must be intelligent. Without mother being intelligent, no intelligent son comes out. A son inherits the quality of mother, and the daughter inherits the quality of father. This is natural. Revatinandana: The letter is so… She’s told me, she says, “Two reasons I want to hear from you: one, I want to know how you are,’’ that’s the body. She says also, “I’m interested in this Krsna consciousness movement,’’ because she’s noticed that the devotees… Prabhupada: That is mother’s anxiety. You see all this? Revatinandana: So I should not respond? Prabhupada: Hm, you can send news: “Mother, I’m all right.’’ That’s all. Revatinandana: That’s all right? Prabhupada: Yes. Don’t worry. No. Caitanya Mahaprabhu also was sending news to His mother. Revatinandana: Oh, I see. Prabhupada: Although He never went to mother. Revatinandana: It’s hard for the family, because my mother’s brother is Visnujana Maharaja’s father, right? So they also figure they have lost one son. They don’t hear from him at all, and now she doesn’t hear from me at all. So the whole family is very miserable. (laughter) Prabhupada: Hm. But they have lost for the better. Revatinandana: Yes, but they don’t understand that. (laughter) Prabhupada: Lost not in vain. They will be benefited. They will be benefited. You are giving the best service to the family. What about your mother, Himavati? Himavati: I never hear from her anymore. Prabhupada: Huh? Himavati: I never hear from her anymore. Prabhupada: She’s also not very happy? Himavati: No. I don’t think she’s very happy with me. Prabhupada: (laughs) Yes. Anyway, you serve Krsna and then your mother will be best served. Krsna will favor all the family members of a devotee. You have seen from Prahlada Maharaja’s statement. Krsna is so kind that anyone coming to become His devotee, He takes care of the family of the devotee—spiritually, for their emancipation. That is natural. Just like government. If somebody dies on the warfield, the government takes care of the whole family. Similarly, if the government has so much sense, do you mean to say Krsna is nonsense? He also takes care of the family of the devotee. Yoga-ksemam vahamy aham [Bg. 9.22]. Where is Nanda Kumara, Pradyumna? Devotee: Pradyumna’s been studying all day. Ah… Nanda Kumara may be…, is he there in the room? Prabhupada: No, I don’t want(?). Maybe sleeping? Devotee: He is tired. Prabhupada: Not very tired. What was it? Devotee: Pradyumna didn’t take rest last night, I don’t think. Prabhupada: Pradyumna… Nanda Kumara was sleeping. Devotee (2): Charlie Chaplin kept us up all night. Prabhupada: Hm. Devotee (2): Charlie Chaplin kept us up all night. (laughs) Charlie Chaplin show. Prabhupada: Hm. That was nice. (laughter) He is really funny man. (laughs) He has got originality. All his comic play has got some originality, that is the beauty. How he invented! (laughs) I think that character, when he was a drunkard, he was a great friend, (laughs) and when he’s not drunkard, “Who is this man?’’ (laughs) He’s grave(?) as rich man. And as drunkard, “You pay. You are my friend, life-long friend. Whatever you want, you take.’’ (laughs) So these characters he’s painting, it’s very good intelligence. And he made him friend when he was going to commit suicide. Devotee (1): Yeah, he stopped him. Prabhupada: He stopped him. Accidentally he stopped. (laughs) Not willingly. Devotee (2): Yes. He tried to pull him up from the water, he went in himself. Prabhupada: It is very nice, funny man with intelligence. And before him there was another, Mr. Max Linder. Devotee: Max Linder. Prabhupada: Yes. He was also very funny Englishman. In our childhood we used to enjoy their play, Max Linder and Chaplin, or Charlie Chaplin. Devotee: They were showing them in India? Prabhupada: Uh? Yes. Max Linder, I remember, he was sitting in a park. (laughter) You know that? Devotee: I don’t know anything about it. Prabhupada: He was sitting in a park, so that English dress, that tail coat? What is called? Devotee: Coattails, yeah. Prabhupada: So the tail was hanging, so some naughty boys, they fixed up nails, you see? So when he got up, the whole tail gone, you see? But he could not understand. He went to the ball dance. So he’s dancing, so everyone’s seeing his tail, in this way. So he thought, “Oh, what is the matter?’’ He went to the mirror and he saw, “Oh, my tail is lost.’’ (laughs) Then he came again in the ball dance and he was pushing everyone, just to show. And everyone was asking, “What is this? What is this?’’ “Oh, you do not know? This is latest fashion. This is latest fashion.’’ Then all of them cut the tails. I think he had taken the idea, (Sanskrit). This is Sanskrit story, that (Sanskrit), or monkey, he lost his tail, and he began to advertise, “This is the latest fashion.’’ So that ball-dancing without tail, that was, I remember, it is very enjoyable. They say that Charlie Chaplin is the student of Max Linder. He learned this funny play from Max Linder. So I knew Charlie Chaplin is an Englishman. Devotee: Yes, he is. Prabhupada: He is Englishman. Devotee (2): He went to America and then he made all these films. Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee: He went to America and he made a lot of money there. Indian: As far as I know, Prabhupada, he was Jew, but he used to live in east of London, or south of London. There is an autobiography about it. Prabhupada: Max Linder, ah, Charlie Chaplin? Yes. He was a London man. Devotee: But that movie was filmed in Los Angeles, the one we saw last night. In Hollywood. All the palm trees and the (indistinct) behind. Indian (Ksirodaksayi?): One of the elder sons, he’s still living in Hampstead Heath. Prabhupada: Oh, his eldest son. And where he is, Charlie Chaplin? Devotee: In America. Prabhupada: In America? Devotee: He’s in Switzerland. Indian: No, no, he lives in Europe somewhere. Switzerland, most… Sometimes coming in Hampstead Heath. Prabhupada: He has got a big family? Devotee: Yes. Prabhupada: You said that he’s producing a still child? Devotee: Yeah, he produced last year, or two years ago. It was in Life magazine. Prabhupada: Hm. (pause) Devotee: It’s already about 10:30. Prabhupada: All right. Devotees: All glories to Srila Prabhupada. (devotees leave) Prabhupada: So ask Pradyumna if he wants to give. Devotee: Yeah. [break] Prabhupada: …visaya chadiya. Oh, yes, then it is (indistinct). Visaya chadiya, se rase majiya mukhe bolo hari hari, parama karuna, pahu dui jana. But even if we do speculation business and do it for Krsna, that is not good. Devotee: Not so high a class. Prabhupada: They are doing little business because grhasthas, they require money. All right, do some incense, this, that. Not very big business. If one is expert like Arjuna or Ambarisa Maharaja, that is different thing. Just like this Advaita, he was given in press. Now he sees that “I can work anywhere I want, so I can get money. Why I should waste my time?’’ He neglected. That means visaya attracted him. He thought, “I am qualified boy. Why I should waste my time with this press?’’ Therefore he went away. He sacrificed Krsna consciousness, and now he’s getting some money he’s satisfied. He’s thinking that he has become a big man. Devotee: Atreya Rsi went to see them in New York the last day, but they wouldn’t come. Prabhupada: Both, (indistinct). Devotee: Yeah. Prabhupada: They are getting money from other karmis, so why they should come? They are thinking that “As family man we must make money.’’ Ato grha-ksetra-sutapta-vittair , huh? House, land, children, friends, money for increasing their illusion. Janasya moho ’yam aham mameti [SB 5.5.8]. (indistinct) He does not know that he is being finished, and he’s thinking that “I am making profit.’’ Parabhavas tavad abodha-jata. This rascal, he’s being defeated. He does not know. He got the chance of Krsna consciousness; he sacrificed Krsna consciousness. And he is attracted by little pounds, dollars. (pause) But his wife is good, Balai dasi. She is coming. Devotee: Yes, she came to mangala-arati. Prabhupada: She comes, and she said, “Then we live separately, Advaita.’’ He doesn’t like. He’s such a rascal. Such a nice, good, beautiful wife, and he’s neglecting. (sounds of Prabhupada taking prasadam) Milk, here they take cold milk, and they (makes sounds of glug-glug-glug drinking). No. Milk should be hot, and it should be taken little. Devotee: Hm. Prabhupada: That is the way of taking milk. And this masala, it does not taste good. In India, especially in Northern India, Punjab, they will take at night, milk, (indistinct). No other things. They, all business men, the Marwari society, they’ll take food before evening and then again they work. Then after ten they will come home and take little milk and go rest. (pause) So foundation committee is being established in Bombay making her the president of the trust. Then Giriraja will have no difficulty. Devotee: Yeah. Prabhupada: They’ll contribute. And if she canvasses, she can collect lakhs. Devotee: But one thing is, if Giriraja takes advantage and begins preaching in her school daily… She’s invited him, open invitation. Prabhupada: Yes. Then it will be pleased. Devotee: Then when she’ll see her students improve, then she’ll give us all help. Prabhupada: Yes. Now we have got land, many people will contribute materials. Materials, we can get materials from many big, big merchants. Devotee: Yeah, like, ah, Tarachand. Prabhupada: Cement, iron, they will… “All right. Give it.’’ Goods, anyone will give. Devotee: Tarachand Gupta, I think his name is. Prabhupada: He is also our life member. He is nice. Devotee: Iron merchant. Prabhupada: He wanted to invite me one day. He met me on the park. Do you remember? Devotee: Yes, I remember. Prabhupada: He’s one of the richest men. Devotee: Yes. I think when you go back there the next year, or next autumn… Prabhupada: Now we have created some impression that we are doing something nice. Even Keating is also impressed. Devotee: Yeah. We’re not wandering from village to village anymore. We’re settled. Prabhupada: No. Even we wander from village to village, people are being impressed that we are doing something good. Actually it is so. I tell you it is so. One who cannot understand it, he is a fool. Actually we are doing the best work, God consciousness. And actually it is a fact: simply for want of God consciousness they are suffering, that’s all. There is no other reason. The only reason is this. Just like this morning I said, “God is the proprietor. Why you are claiming proprietor? You may be manager, not proprietor.’’ Actually that is our position. Just like I am head of this institution, but I am not dealing as proprietor. I am dealing as manager, head. Is it not? Devotee: This is the only society where Krsna is the owner of everything. Prabhupada: And all my assistants, they are also working in that capacity. If I would have been proprietor, then they would not have been interested. Devotee: Hm. Prabhupada: I would have collected the money and used for my sense gratification. Then nobody would help me. Devotee: I think the English milk is better than American milk, isn’t it? Prabhupada: I think so. It is from Holland. Devotee: Oh. There’s some famous islands between England and Holland called the Jersey Islands. There’s special milk that comes from Jersey. Jersey milk is best. Prabhupada: No. These Europeans, Americans, if they take to Krsna consciousness, they’ll be more happy. That is assured. From all angles of vision—their family life, their political life, their social life, their cultural life, their religious life, their philosophical life, their scientific life—everything will be perfect. Now you have to teach them. I can give you the ideas how they’ll be happy. The rascals, they do not know why, what is your specialness, and just to teach you this. My only ambition is that you are… (aside:) Oh, there is no water. You are supposed to be the most intelligent persons. (Prabhupada drinks) So if you take, others will take. That is going on. So I have no distinction between East and West. They’re thinking that East is conquering West by culture. That is their enviousness. (laughter) That is, they are afraid. Because the Britishers, they kept Indian culture suppressed so long because… [break] …the ksatriya, kings, in special cases. Not for public. Among the ksatriyas. And among the vaisyas, one day in a year, when they were allocated(?), to try one’s luck. One day they’ll bet. Not amongst the brahmanas or the sudras. Sudras have no money to gamble, and brahmanas prohibited. The ksatriyas, they were also allowed in special cases, and the vaisyas were allowed to engage in gambling one day in a year. That means restricted. Devotee: Boy, that system of dharma… We can start discussing it tomorrow in our philosophy class. It’s just so perfect. Everything is… Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Whole plan is perfect. Devotee: But the British systematically broke it down. Prabhupada: Because Lord Macauley(?) gave them in this study, they said that if you keep the Indians in their original culture, then they cannot be broken. Gandhi took that state: noncooperation. Don’t cooperate with them. And then kill them. Devotee: This man who wrote this book made an interesting comment. He said that after…, or before the First World War, when the British were entering the First World War, they made a promise to the Indians that “If you help us fight this war, then we will give you freedom afterwards.” Prabhupada: They did not. Devotee: They helped, but they didn’t give them freedom. So Gandhi or the others, they took that asat. “They have broken their promise, so now we can break ours, noncooperation.” Prabhupada: Yes. They actually expanded their empire all over the (indistinct) world by Indian cooperation. Therefore these big men like Attlee, when they thought that “India is going out of our hands,’’ so don’t (indistinct) up our empire. Forget it. They voluntarily (indistinct). Devotee: The whole thing. (laughs) Prabhupada: Now they are not, those Englishmen, as they were in Victorian day. Nobody cares for you. Devotee: You’ll see the last remnants at that Commonwealth Club, I think, engagement. No more, no one cares. Prabhupada: Commonwealth is in name. (pause) Devotee: Still, there is something about London. Everyone likes to come here. There’s so many… There’s not enough hotel rooms even. Prabhupada: Hm? Devotee: There’s not even enough hotel rooms to accommodate so many tourists who come here to London. Prabhupada: London is still famous. People outside, they have got very high idea about London. Devotee: Civilized. Very civilized city. Prabhupada: Why civilized? Do you think it is especially civilized? Devotee: Well, a lot more than America anyway. By comparison it seems civilized, in the sense that there is not so much violence. There’s not… People are honest, upright, moral, a little more. Prabhupada: In America general life is becoming wretched. Devotee: Wretched. Police don’t even carry guns here. Prabhupada: Hm? Devotee: Policemen don’t even carry guns in Britain, but in America every policeman’s got at least one gun. Prabhupada: The Englishman… I’ve studied Englishman. They consider America is still uncivilized. They say like that. (indistinct) Devotee: Still uncivilized, yeah. Prabhupada: But here also hippy-ism growing. Devotee: They’ve lost that old aristocracy civilization. Losing it fast. Prabhupada: So write Giriraja immediately a letter, that she agreed to be president of the trust. You make a trust body for fund-raising, and our best life members, like Sumati Morarji, and make her the president of the trust. You remain the secretary, and other also, as treasurer also. One or two of her own men. Devotee: Just a small number. Not a big trust. Prabhupada: Hm. In this way you raise funds. Devotee: Meanwhile, he should start utilizing her invitation to teach in the schools sometimes. Prabhupada: Yes, and she’ll cooperate. And write letter for permission for carrying our motorcar and incense. Devotee: Yes, and inform Gurudasa… Prabhupada: She has already agreed, that, ah, what is called? Punks? The punks sent to Calcutta, and from there then send to Los Angeles. Devotee: Yeah. I’m wondering why they can’t take them directly. Prabhupada: Directly not very many ships come to Hong Kong. Devotee: Oh, from Hong Kong that way, that direction, they don’t come. They come on their way back. I see. Yeah, they take Chinese goods from Hong Kong to India. Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee: They take Chinese goods from Hong Kong to India. Prabhupada: Oh. Devotee: There’s not many from Hong Kong to America. Prabhupada: Yes. Therefore she said send to India. Take information. Devotee: Transfer to another boat. That will save them a thousand dollars a month. Prabhupada: That’s nice. That’s a thousand dollar contribution. Devotee: Yeah. And as it grows, it will increase. Prabhupada: And send them a Gujarati paper, our magazine, distribution amongst their workers. That will satisfy (indistinct) sense. Devotee: Hm. Tell that to Giriraja? Prabhupada: Yes. Devotee: Hundred, two hundred magazines. Prabhupada: Not hundred. Say fifty, for distribution amongst his officers. Devotee: Oh. Prabhupada: So that everyone will be satisfied. Devotee: I think Ksirodakasayi has the information on that car business. Because he once inquired and got papers. He may have them here. Prabhupada: Yes. So make arrangement. At least two cars, nice cars. Devotee: One car and one van? Prabhupada: Hm? Devotee: One car and one van? Prabhupada: Van? What is the use of van? Devotee: Well, they can carry many people, that’s the thing, like a sankirtana party. Prabhupada: Sankirtana may be six men. They can go in car. Devotee: (laughs) Yeah. Prabhupada: And better for carrying our luggage, add to the car some small… Devotee: Trailer. Prabhupada: …trailer, yes, two wheel. Oh, it will go. Devotee: The advantage of the van is that they can sleep in it. Prabhupada: Huh? Devotee: The advantage of a van is that it can be used for sleeping purposes also. Prabhupada: Sleeping purposes in India, tropical country, if you carry camp, if you want to sleep somewhere you just immediately set up a camp and pass night very comfortable. And you go on the field passing stool. Just catch up some watery place. (laughter) You can cook, you can take bath, you can wash your dishes, then put Devotee: Mostly we’ll be going to big… Prabhupada: I’ll agree if you can send one van also, two cars and one van. Devotee: Mostly we’ll be going to bigger cities anyway. The roads between big cities are all right. But if we go places… Prabhupada: Work sincerely and everything will be supplied by Krsna. Now take… (end)
with His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada
London, August 1, 1972