Morning Room Conversation Satsvarupa: If you associate with a certain type of people, your reputation will be that you are like them, and you’ll become like them. Prabhupada: (chuckling) So our Sridhara Maharaja’s associates are not very good. Then what is his position? Satsvarupa: It cannot be said that he is opposed to them. Prabhupada: Hm? Satsvarupa: You can’t say he is opposed to them if he always associates with them. They’re envious… Prabhupada: (sarcastically) Very good associates. That is his associate. He may not be very… No, everyone is not openly envious, everyone, but we can understand by behavior. Nobody is openly envious. Satsvarupa: Just by keeping apart, he…, that…, he shows there’s some enviousness. (long pause) Prabhupada: Where is my cap? Satsvarupa: (aside:) Maybe he had it. Prabhupada: So socks will be required? [break] Tamala Krsna: But they have no… Their philosophy has no real basis. Prabhupada: That cannot appeal to the higher educated person. Tamala Krsna:There’s nothing to it. Not giving knowledge of God. Prabhupada: And their behavior… Tamala Krsna: Is abominable. Prabhupada: The injunction is “Thou shall not kill.” They are simply killing. How it will be effective? Tamala Krsna: The priests are doing all rascal nonsense. Homosex. Prabhupada: They announced that…(?) There is a hospital for drunkard priest. Tamala Krsna: Alcoholic priests. Prabhupada: And they have introduced gambling. Tamala Krsna: And homosex. Prabhupada: Homosex, what is that religion? And they’re passing to homosex, religion. They’re getting married man to man. Most degraded. Hari-sauri: There’s no difference between the behavior of a priest and the behavior of a gross atheist… Prabhupada: Yes. Hari-sauri: …except he’s dressed as a priest. Prabhupada: That’s all. Dress only. Hari-sauri: But they have exactly the same mentality. Tamala Krsna: Business. Hari-sauri: It’s simply a way of making a livelihood. Prabhupada: That is everywhere. Here also. Tamala Krsna: Is there some mention in the Bhagavatam about this, that the religious men will wear only the clothes to make a profit? That people will wear religious clothing simply for making profit? Now religion is a good business. They take it like that. Prabhupada: Yes. Tamala Krsna: Good business. Prabhupada: Yes. They exploit the sentiment. Tamala Krsna: A man, when he thinks of his occupation, he thinks, “I can still get married and be the leader of the church. I’ll get married, have a family, and this will be my profession, to be a priest.” Hari-sauri: Yes. That’s what it is. It’s a profession only. Prabhupada: Profession. Hari-sauri: One of my friends was considering, “Shall I…” He had come to a point where he was thinking, “Now I’ll either become a police officer or I’ll become a priest.” But he couldn’t quite make his mind up. Prabhupada: In our college days we read one book. That was our textbook. It is a story, that a boy was meant for church and he fell in love with a girl. That is the psychology. Cloister and the Hearth. What is the cloister? Hari-sauri: Inner sanctuary. Prabhupada: And hearth? Home. Tamala Krsna: Home. Prabhupada: That book was named Cloister and Hearth. So get Bombay finished very quickly and book-printing, stock, propaganda. [break] Tamala Krsna: …society is growing on that principle. Prabhupada: Yes. This I want to increase more and more. No money in the bank. In the books. And as soon as there will be stock of book, it has to be sold. Otherwise you will starve. (chuckling) That I want. Tamala Krsna: That will force the book sales to increase. The manager… Prabhupada: You may take it as business or whatever you like. I am not taking anything. You are selling five to six lakhs daily? Tamala Krsna: Yes. Prabhupada: So my royalty would have been one lakh, fifty thousand daily. Big authors, they take twenty-five percent. So that is not the ambition, but my ambition is these books shall be sold. That’s all. Whole… Every house should have our books, every gentleman, in any language. It doesn’t matter. That is our propaganda. Now you are getting all languages, so we can capture the whole world. Tamala Krsna: Increase the book sales more and more. Prabhupada: And we are getting success, at that. There is no question of discouragement. Tamala Krsna: Especially here in India it’s becoming more and more encouraging. Prabhupada: Now these books I have read, either Bengali or Hindi, they are well-written, very convincing. All our books are convincing. Tamala Krsna: This is a very handsome type of binding. It’s called… I’m not sure who has done… I think the libraries do. It’s called “permabound.” It’s your pocketbook edition but bound into a hard cover. Very handy book. Prabhupada: Recent publication? Tamala Krsna: I don’t… I’m not… I don’t think that actually the BBT did this binding. This is done by someone else, but somehow I managed… It was in my office, so I brought it with me. But it’s very nice to get the small pocket-size book but with a hard cover. For traveling it’s very handy. On the back it gives mention inside of…, what the binding is. Prabhupada: Where it is done? Tamala Krsna: In USA. “Permabound” it’s called. Hari-sauri: That’s like that plastic cover-type stuff. Prabhupada: It is half-bound. Tamala Krsna: Yes. Prabhupada: Yes, yes. Hari-sauri: No, what they’ve done is they’ve taken off the paper cover, this pink, and they just hardbound it… Prabhupada: Softbound. Hari-sauri: …and stuck it back on. Tamala Krsna: And plastic. Hari-sauri: And plastic over the top. Tamala Krsna: Very nice. Prabhupada: Yes. Tamala Krsna: Wonderful book, Nectar of Devotion. Prabhupada: Every book is… Teachings of Lord Caitanya, Nectar of Devotion. Whichever he will read, he will become Krsna conscious. [break] And then Krsna, then Bhagavata, then Caitanya-caritamrta, simply development. Tamala Krsna: This book is now very nice because there are many fine illustrations inside, more than there used to be. They’ve added. The Teachings of Lord Caitanya, I was thinking in particular. I have a copy of that, and there are many color illustrations inside now. Wonderful book, the summary of all of Caitanya-caritamrta. Like Bhaktivinoda Thakura’s introduction gives a whole… It’s like all of the pastimes of Lord Caitanya condensed into a few pages. Prabhupada: Yes. That is there in the Teaching of Lord Caitanya. Tamala Krsna: Yes, teachings of Lord Caitanya. This is… You remember that… Prabhupada: Near Bombay. Tamala Krsna: Bombay, at Rama temple you stayed at. This was taken by Brijbasi. They took this picture. [break] Prabhupada: …rasamrta-sindhu like my other books, word to word. Then Bon Maharaja began. So Bon Maharaja could not do it. Only he published only a part of it with gorgeous sound, that, only that eleven hundred or one thousand copies printed forever. Tamala Krsna: To show. Name only. Prabhupada: Name only. Hari-sauri: And they’re all still in his (indistinct). Prabhupada: Then I thought that “Not in that way. Let me have the summary study. Then it will be…” Tamala Krsna: It’s really nice that some of your books are like this, in summary study. It’s a nice variety. Some are very scholarly presented and some are very for the other person. Prabhupada: Krsna is summary study of the Tenth Canto. That is also very nice. Tamala Krsna: Oh. Hari-sauri: Krsna book stories are wonderful. Tamala Krsna: Most popular book. Prabhupada: Accha? Tamala Krsna: Oh, they love that. Of course, Bhagavad-gita is the most well known, but people enjoy that Krsna book. From the Krsna book they get the clear idea who Krsna is. Prabhupada: Yes. That was my… “Let them know at least what is Krsna.” That is selling nicely. Tamala Krsna: Yes. Very nicely. I would say that the lay public, that is to say the people who attend our temples but are not becoming the full-time devotees, they especially read Krsna book and Gita. Prabhupada: And that theologian, he says, “I want to support Krsna.” He said? Tamala Krsna: Oh, yes. “It must be Krsna’s name; otherwise I’m not…” Prabhupada: (laughs) Then he has become devotee. Tamala Krsna: He’s a big man, Harvey Cox, the top theologian in the country. Prabhupada: Our George Harrison, he also liked Krsna book. Hari-sauri: Yes. We sold so many Krsna books on the strength of showing them that… Prabhupada: George Harrison. Hari-sauri: …Introduction from George Harrison. Prabhupada: Yes. And I have acknowledged his contribution and blessed him as good boy. And because he served Krsna, then later on he became inclined to give us that house. Tamala Krsna: Has that house been transferred actually yet? Prabhupada: Never mind what is the… We are using it. If he says “Go out,” we shall go out. What is that? We are not after property. Tamala Krsna: And he’ll never say that. Prabhupada: No. I don’t think he’s so mean-minded. No. He’s not mean-minded. He’s a good boy. I’ve studied. Tamala Krsna: Ravi Shankar has taken advantage of him. These two pujaris, the two brothers… Prabhupada: They’re ideal. Tamala Krsna: …they look like they’re out of the Caitanya-caritamrta. They appear as two persons right out of that book. Prabhupada: Yes. Very good boys. Tamala Krsna: Vaikuntha men. Prabhupada: Oh, yes. They do not know except the duty. Very good boys. Tamala Krsna: Perfect team of brothers. Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Therefore Krsna has brought them here in Mayapura. Previously they were advanced, all of you. You are simply born because the mission was to be started. Just like in Yadu-vamsa Krsna ordered all the devotee demigods to “Go and take birth there to help Me.” Similarly, you are also… You were born in Europe, America, to help this. Otherwise you were devotees in you past lives. I have explained that in my recent writings. The purport was mam eti: goes to Krsna where His pastime is going on, and then they are transferred to the original. So all the devotees picked up and they were placed together where Krsna is having His pastimes in either of these innumerable universes. He’s going on. Just the moving… The sun is moving—little, little, little. So Krsna’s pastimes go on—this universe, that universe, that universe, that universe. In some universe He’s present. In all universes present, that is called nitya-lila. So those who are advanced, perfect devotees, first of all they are sent there and then, further trained up, they enter. Mam eti. Just like after passing the administration examination he’s made one assistant of some magistrate, and then gradually he’ll be promoted up to the high court judge. Hari-sauri: When we were in New York this last summer you said that the spiritual master also has associates who appear along with him to help him in his mission. Prabhupada: Yes. Krsna wants His assistants; the spiritual master also requires assistant. Everything is going on under Krsna’s direct supervision. Mayadhyaksena prakrtih suyate sa-caracaram [Bg. 9.10] isvarah sarva-bhutanam hrd-dese ’rjuna tisthati bhramayan sarva-bhutani yantrarudhani mayaya [Bg. 18.61] So Bombay work is going on. Tamala Krsna: Full-scale work. Prabhupada: People come to see even what is going on now. Tamala Krsna: Yes. Many big people come to see. When I was there a very big life member came with his wife. Giriraja is constantly giving tours of the construction, showing, “This will be like this; this will be like this.” People are very impressed. There is no such place in all of Bombay. Prabhupada: No, no, no. Tamala Krsna: In all of India there’s no such place. Prabhupada: No, no. Tamala Krsna: And they recognize it. Especially the fact that it is so… Prabhupada: This is Saurabha’s credit. He has designed. Tamala Krsna: Yes. Prabhupada: Yes. Tamala Krsna: The utilization is especially unique. It is so much more than just a temple. That is what’s impressing—the restaurant, the theater, temple… Prabhupada: Every inch is utilized. Hari-sauri: What they call a complex. Tamala Krsna: Very unique. One thing we don’t have is a university. Prabhupada: No, that is not possible within that small (laughs)… Tamala Krsna: Not in that area. But I’m just thinking in terms of programs, that one time you wanted in Gorakhpur to do something. Prabhupada: That you can do in Hyderabad. Six hundred acres. Hari-sauri: At least we have our gurukula in Vrndavana. Prabhupada: Yes, Vrndavana. Tamala Krsna: Was that your plan for Kuruksetra, to have a university there? Prabhupada: If you can develop all this, you don’t require separate. But if the government donates the land or give us acquiring, then we can do something. That life member, big life member, came to see? Tamala Krsna: Yes. Very big man. I don’t remember his name. New member. Giriraja was giving a tour. It should be very finely built. It should not be too hastily made. Prabhupada: No, no. Tamala Krsna: Just like I notice that this building is actually first class. The construction is very first class. It’s very solid. Prabhupada: Hm. Very solid. Tamala Krsna: We should not sacrifice the quality. Prabhupada: No, no. We have appointed there first-class engi… Tamala Krsna: Just like I notice many modern, many newer buildings in India, because they are rushing the work it is not of the same quality. Just like Birla’s. All of their homes are very fine. And also the Bangurs of Calcutta. Their homes… They take a lot of time that all the marble is made properly, everything. The walls are done nicely. Prabhupada: Yes. So let it be done like that. Tamala Krsna: Our members, they have discrimination. They can tell when something is done first class or not. Prabhupada: You have been in Vrndavana? Tamala Krsna: Not yet. Last time was two years ago. Prabhupada: That building is also coming very nice. Tamala Krsna: Gurukula. Prabhupada: Gurukula. Very gorgeous and nice. And if there are gates and road in our name, (laughing) that will be unique in India. Then people will come to Vrndavana to see our… Nowadays also, they are coming to see our temple. Anyone who comes. That prasada distribution is going on in the evening? Devotee: Daily. Prabhupada: Yes. That must be done. Anyone who comes to see the arati, at least two puris, little vegetable, halava should be given. Prasada distribution should go on everywhere. Who said that that is my trick? Who was…? Hari-sauri: He was just saying last night. Prabhupada: Oh, somebody… Hari-sauri: Secret weapon. Prabhupada: (laughs) Yes. Tamala Krsna: Secret weapon, yes. Prabhupada: Yes. So Jayapataka has not returned? Devotee: No. Not yet. Tamala Krsna: Not as yet. Prabhupada: That will be very nice center, Panihati. Then we shall control the whole Ganges from Calcutta to Mayapura. We’ll have so many steamers. (laughs) Hari-sauri: Steamers and ferries. Prabhupada: Yes. At least four steamers always plying from Calcutta to Mayapura. Therefore I am after that center. It will be middle station. And you can go in this way, Rijay(?), by electricity. Go this side, that side, this side, that side. Tamala Krsna: Everyone will take those steamers. Prabhupada: It will be very nice recreation also, to go by the steamer here, there. Hari-sauri: Have kirtana on board… Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Hari-sauri: …lectures… Prabhupada: Yes. Hari-sauri: …prasada distribution, Deities. Tamala Krsna: I think the government knows what you are doing. Prabhupada: They know. They appreciate. The Home Member has appreciated. He personally told Gopala Krsna, “Yes, we want that this movement should spread all over the world.” Not in writing, but verbally he has stated, although he’s Christian. Every sane man will appreciate. Indira Gandhi also. You said that she has advised. Tamala Krsna: Yes. Prabhupada: Unless she appreciates, why she has done? And the ambassador. Tamala Krsna: Yes. He has given his certification. At first he was unwilling, but he became… When he got permission from India, then… Prabhupada: Indian government should be proud that Indian culture is being accepted in America. Hari-sauri: They can see that we’re a lot more effective than any Christian ministry. We’re a lot more effective in the work we’re doing for spreading their culture, or Indian culture, than the Christians are in India. Prabhupada: Just like Gandhi. Gandhi was so big man. His nonviolence creed, who has accepted it? Tamala Krsna: No one. Prabhupada: Although nonviolence is a very good word, but who can accept it? We don’t say such rascal things, imagination. We introduce Krsna, encouraging, “Fight!” Nonsense nonviolence. (chuckles) “Ksatriya, you should fight. Don’t talk nonsense.” Kutas tva kasmalam idam. “What kind of talking you are doing? You’re My friend.” And he wanted to introduce nonviolence. Where is nonviolence in Gita? Artificial, all artificial. Hari-sauri: When Arjuna wanted to stop fighting, Krsna chastised him. Prabhupada: And he wants to prove nonviolence from Gita. Just see how foolish he was. If you say publicly that he was a rascal, fool, then you become unpopular. But actually he was a rascal fool. (laughs) Artificial. Krsna says, “You fight,” and these rascals say, “Nonviolent.” He’s more than cheating. Mayavadi. Hari-sauri: Cheater. Prabhupada: Yes. Cheater, one must be due to ignorance. Generally one who is fool, he commits criminality. No sane man does it. Sane means he knows what is what. He does not commit mistake. But to commit mistake means he’s insane, ignorant. That is not innocence—ignorance, foolish. Tamala Krsna: There’s a difference between ignorance and innocence. Prabhupada: Innocence, he…, like a child. But ignorant means he has no knowledge; he is animal. So what about the advertisement? He has not done? Hari-sauri: The book advertisement? Did you see that? Prabhupada wrote out an advertisement, “Read Hare Krsna books, worldwide Hare Krsna books, and be happy.” Then he listed all the books and where to buy them from. Prabhupada: And I gave him 22,000 rupees. Tamala Krsna: Gopala Krsna? Hari-sauri: Yes. He was supposed to put it in all the newspapers. Tamala Krsna: He didn’t mention anything to me. I was there only for one day, but he did not mention it. I can write him if you want. He’ll be coming here… Hari-sauri: The 25th or 26th. Tamala Krsna: Yes. Ten days. I’m sure he must have done it, if you have told him to. Prabhupada: We cannot understand what is the position of this land acquisition. They’ll remain silent? Tamala Krsna: There’s some political thing behind it. That’s sure. Prabhupada: The political was Ramakrishna Mission and Tirtha Maharaja. Tamala Krsna: Really? Ramakrishna Mission. Envious. Even though they’re not near here, still they can understand how prominent we would become. Prabhupada: We have already become more than, more important than. Tamala Krsna: Tirtha Maharaja’s brother is active now? Prabhupada: What…? Rejected. I think of them, dead. They may think themselves that they very full of life, but I think they are dead. What is the use of fighting with the dead body? Dead horse and what is the use of whipping? A dead horse will rise up by whipping? Tamala Krsna: Yeah, “Beating the dead horse.” There’s a saying. Prabhupada: I think all of them are dead. Hari-sauri: Yes, they’re not doing anything. They’ve retired. They built their own little place, and now they’re retired. Prabhupada: There is no activity throughout the whole world, er, whole year. Only they come during the festival. Tamala Krsna: They use this festival as a means of collecting money… Prabhupada: That’s it. Tamala Krsna: …for the rest of the year. Prabhupada: That’s it. That they actually do. With this festival, they collect. Whatever they collect, they spend twenty-five percent for the festival, and seventy-five percent they keep it for eating whole year. This is their business. That’s a fact, they admit it. And they have no other source. Hari-sauri: They’re not very well supported now either. Prabhupada: Who knows them? Why they will be support it? My Guru Maharaja used to, (Bengali): “A pandemonium of eating and sleeping. Joint mess.” Joint mess, just without any Deity, nobody will pay. Therefore… Not for preaching. So make this program immediately. Bring huge quantity of books and distribute. And see that books are not wasted, not stolen, neglected. This is our life and soul property. Jaya. (end)
with His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada
February 16, 1977, Mayapura