Room Conversation Gopala Krsna: …and Atreya Rsi wouldn’t have met. Prabhupada: Any sane man will receive our… Gopala Krsna: He’s helping us in Karachi to open a temple now. And in Lebanon also… Prabhupada: Everyone is accepting. It is for all, even Communist countries. Everyone is accepting our literature, our attempt. That’s a fact. And you do not heard about the report in the South Africa. South Africa, the Europeans hate the Indians like anything. Now they’re receiving our literature. That means they will now appreciate Indian culture. They’ll understand that India has got some substance. Gopala Krsna: This is very important point to bring up even with the government. Prabhupada: Gandhi tried twenty years to get little equal rights. The General Smuts refused. He was failure in South Africa. And then he decided that “I shall drive these Europeans, Englishmen, from India.” He came. That also he could not do. Here also, for thirty years he struggled. He was failure, nonviolent. It is Subhash Bose’s INA which drove away these Englishmen. You know that? That Indian Army, what is that, INA, Indian National Army? When he organized this National Army, then the Englishmen came to sense that “Now we cannot rule over.” This rascal was going on, nonviolence… (laughter) While… “We shall pat them: ‘Oh, yes, you are so powerful. Oh, why you are trying to drive away?’ ” And he’ll be… “Oh…” The Baitland(?) Colony in a loincloth, and engaged in the sun chair.(?) He had no practical knowledge. He started the movement from 1917, and actually it was… Independence was given, 1947. Thirty years he failed. Twenty years he failed there. He spoils fifty years for nothing, and distorting Bhagavad-gita, that in Bhagavad-gita there is nonviolence. Such a rascal. Bhagavad-gita begins with, with this word, dharma-ksetre kuru-ksetre yuyutsavah: [Bg. 1.1] “Two parties desiring to fight.” That is the beginning. Yudhyasva mam anusmara [Bg. 8.7] And Krsna’s whole life is yuddha, fighting. Before His birth, plan was being made how to kill Him. This is yuddha. Kamsa was planning. And after His birth He had to go away, just to make a show, from His father’s house to another house incognito to avoid yuddha. And when yuddha began, three months old, He killed Putana. Tamala Krsna: Violence from the beginning. Prabhupada: Then Trnavarta, big, big yuddha. Then Aghasura, Bakasura, Sakatasura, this asura, this asura, that asura, in childhood, in Vrndavana, so many. Then, when He went to Mathura, big, big elephant, big, big wrestler. Then Kamsa. Then, after Kamsa, then Jarasandha, Paundraka, then kidnapping His wives. Fighting, only fighting. And these rascals say, “I do not like this Krsna.” You have heard that? He is creating his own Krsna, this Gandhi. Yasomatinandana: They also say, Srila Prabhupada, that the Krsna of Mahabharata is different from Krsna of Bhagavata. Prabhupada: Just see. How they are distorting history and everything. And in Mahabharata… He’s advertising himself as staunch student of Bhagavad-gita, and he is distorting the meaning in so many ways. That is his business. And he’s mahatma. Mahatma means mahatmanas tu mam partha daivim prakrtim asritah, bhajanty ananya… [Bg. 9.13]. Mahatma is a great devotee who has no other business than to obey the orders of Krsna. Bhajanti. Bhajana-seva. And he’s is discarding, distorting, and he’s mahatma. Just see. If you study, scrutinizing, these men have done greatest disservice to the country, to the people in general. And they have received no result. And I have worked ten years only with Bhagavad-gita As It Is. Gopala Krsna: So much result. Prabhupada: Yes. The rascals are so blind. Phalena pariciyate. The result is here. Yasomatinandana: And he’s called father of the nation. Prabhupada: Therefore your nation is like that Gopala Krsna: Nation is so poor now. Prabhupada: Poor means… The party, Congress Party, practically achieved. Credit is there. And they are now ruined. This is their progress. Gopala Krsna: They’re fighting even more now. Srila Prabhupada? Surabhi Swami is going back to Bombay… Prabhupada: So what can I do? Money. Money is… If there is here, you can take. Surabhi Swami comes for money, I know that. He’ll give me some plan. If there is money, we’ll pay. Tamala Krsna: How much money do you want? Gopala Krsna: I had a meeting in Bombay by Giriraja… Prabhupada: Meeting or no meeting, you want money and squander. That I know. So if there is money, he’ll give you. Throw away. Tamala Krsna: They want a lot of money, though. Prabhupada: Lot of money give and throw. What can be done! I know. Gopala Krsna: We can explain to Tamala Krsna. Tamala Krsna: They’re asking twenty-two lakhs of rupees. Prabhupada: No, give twenty-two crores, I don’t mind. Then do it. Gopala Krsna: It will be paid back starting… Prabhupada: All right. Gopala Krsna: Ramesvara promised us to pay it back. Prabhupada: All right. That’s all right. Gopala Krsna: Then we can get the building complete in October. Prabhupada: Whatever money you have got, you squander. I don’t mind. I know that the kitchen, so much money is squandered, and that is given. Squander. And increase the period of squander. That I know. So don’t bother me now with your money. But finish within that period. That’s all. Gopala Krsna: Yes. Prabhupada: That is my only request. Otherwise, you are squandering money. Do it. Do it. But after all, do it in time. I’m not going to live for long. If possible, I’ll see and… Gopala Krsna: Every Sunday in Bombay hundreds of people come just to look at the building. It is so attractive. Prabhupada: Yes. So kindly finish it. Take money and squander and finish it at a time. Surabhi: Srila Prabhupada? When I was in Jaipur I inquired from some people regarding your health, because I met Yasodanandana Swami in Delhi, and he told me that you wanted to know from an astrologer about the situation. So I went to one man who was previously the advisor of the Maharaja of Mansingh of Jaipur. One life member brought me to him. So I inquired. Prabhupada: What he is? Surabhi: He’s a pandita. He uses numerology. Prabhupada: Hm? Numerology? Surabhi: Numerology. By numbers. So he takes the name and then he… So he said… You want to know what he said? He told me that your disease is going to last altogether about two and a half years, two years and five months, of which eight months have passed. Prabhupada: Still I shall live? Surabhi: He said that these three months now are most critical, but then, after three months, things will go better, but there will be ups and downs for about one and a half more years. Then he said after that it will be quite all right. Prabhupada: Three months? Surabhi: It will be very… Prabhupada: Difficult. Surabhi: Difficult. Yes. After three months, and he said that you will travel again then. But he said there is no absolute danger. Prabhupada: So. There is some sense. Tamala Krsna: Everybody’s saying the same thing like this. Surabhi: And he would like a report of these nine days that are going on now, and then he wants to study again more to give more information. I was there on the fifth. Prabhupada: So give him a place to send to… Tamala Krsna: He works by numbers, not by astrology. He’s not an astrologer. Prabhupada: Oh, so he knows my birth date and year. Surabhi: Yes. He knows. Tamala Krsna: I gave him your birth date and time. Prabhupada: Oh. Tamala Krsna: I mean now I gave him the time. Surabhi: No, I had everything. Tamala Krsna: You told him? Surabhi: Yes. Tamala Krsna: Is that a science, Srila Prabhupada, that numbers? Prabhupada: Yes. Surabhi: And before I asked the question, he told me what my question was. So he said, “You have two questions.” I said, “No, I have one.” He said, “No, you have two.” Because my question was how long you will stay. So he said, “No, you want to know about health and about life span.” So he gave both answers. He also said that the medicine… The best thing for you to take is milk of a black cow and juice, fruit juice. That is the best to take. Prabhupada: Fruit juice. Surabhi: Yes. Lot of juice and milk of black cow. And then tulasi. Prabhupada: That is not difficult. Tamala Krsna: That you’re practically doing. Prabhupada: But he said “black cow.” Surabhi: He insisted on black cow. Yasomatinandana: Syamala. Surabhi: And if black is not… Bhagatji is looking for a black cow. He’s been looking for the last two weeks. And also tulasi, he said. That is very important to take. Prabhupada: So you have? You can give me. Surabhi: Other things are not necessary, he said. Prabhupada: Accha? No medicine? Surabhi: No. No medicine. Tamala Krsna: Good doctor. (laughter) Prabhupada: So meet him again and take particularly everything. So you can go. Surabhi: Yes, Srila Prabhupada. Now I have to go. My train is leaving in about twenty minutes. Prabhupada: So you can go. Surabhi: So I have to go to Mathura. Jaya Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada: You arrange. In this stage, don’t tax me very much. Now I have authorized that will and everything. Follow that. You believe. Gopala Krsna: We’ll discuss it with Tamala. Prabhupada: As far as…, don’t tax me. And printing, don’t mind for price. Do it quickly and nicely. Gopala Krsna: Yes, Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada: That is… As quickly as possible. No manuscript should be left vacant. That I want. Here and there I have more money invested. Now you don’t… Gopala Krsna: No. We’re not leaving anything. Prabhupada: Yes. Gopala Krsna: There are four Gujarati books now also coming out. Prabhupada: Print. Gopala Krsna: Yes, we have already finalized. Prabhupada: Print. Gopala Krsna: Those Diwali cards, Srila Prabhupada, which I showed you? They’re selling very well. Prabhupada: That is business, earn money. That’s all. Gopala Krsna: Yes. That’s why I… Every day we are getting orders of more than thousand cards just in Delhi. Prabhupada: Just see. Gopala Krsna: And now I’ve just written… I’m adding three more cards to the line to give people more variety. So… Prabhupada: Very good. So there you have got business. You have got money. Why you are miser? Earn money and spend money. That’s all. I know this business. Earn money and spend money. Gopala Krsna: I try to make it… Prabhupada: Throughout my whole life I have done this. Earn money and spend money. I am not miser. Tamala Krsna: No. When you wanted something… Prabhupada: See money. Earn money and see money. I don’t follow this policy. Tamala Krsna: When you wanted something, you’d spend anything. Prabhupada: Yes. Tamala Krsna: Just like that land in Bombay, that house… Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Whatever everyone wanted, “All right, take it.” Finish. I know. I am giving ten thousand more, fifteen thousand more. I didn’t mind. “Take it and finish business tomorrow. Take it.” Tamala Krsna: That man was surprised that you didn’t bargain with him. Prabhupada: No. I simply asked, “Whether you are going to finish it tomorrow. So I have agreed to pay.” He said, “Yes, I can.” What is that? Dhananjaya: This is a Deity of yourself, Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada: Eh? Dhananjaya: This is a Deity prepared here of you. Prabhupada: (laughs) So what shall I do? (laughter) Gopala Krsna: He just wanted to show it to you, Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada: Nice. Dhananjaya: This is one for the temples. Gopala Krsna: They like it very much. Prabhupada: Yes. Tamala Krsna: Isn’t it very small? Dhananjaya: Well, I showed this to all the GBC, and Balavanta took especially great interest. Prabhupada: It is silver? Dhananjaya: No. In brass. Prabhupada: Brass. Gopala Krsna: Can you silver-coat it? Dhananjaya: Yes, we can silver… Prabhupada: They have done nice. Tamala Krsna: It’s very small. Dhananjaya: But this is also meant for householders. Tamala Krsna: It’s nice for householders, but for big temples it’s very… Dhananjaya: For small temples. Prabhupada: No… Dhananjaya: We’d also like to prepare one of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura. Tamala Krsna: It looks good. Prabhupada: But looks good, that’s good. (laughter) Abhirama: I know I would like to have one in my house. Prabhupada: Yes. It is good. Tamala Krsna: Playing the karatalas, preaching. Prabhupada: Nobody’s going to see what is within. He looks good, that’s good. Just like they are making statue very nice. Tamala Krsna: In Los Angeles, Bharadvaja. Prabhupada: So do nicely, quickly, and spend money. That’s all. (laughter) I want to see things are done very nice. Never mind money is spent. Dhananjaya: I also looked into this weaving of silk Benares saris. Prabhupada: Hm? Dhananjaya: You mentioned that we should encourage cottage industries here and… Prabhupada: What is that? Gopala Krsna: Cottage industries. Prabhupada: Ha. Dhananjaya: And so these handlooms are available, but along with the looms you must have expert weavers, handloomers. Prabhupada: So why you are bothering if you have no expert? You have to find out expert weaver. Why? We are not for industry. Why should we divert our attention unnecessarily? Dhananjaya: But you did mention previously that our ISKCON ladies, if they so desire, they can learn. Prabhupada: If they are idle, then you can give engagement. Otherwise don’t bring engagements. If they are idle—there is no work—give them. Not that you bring engagement and then… We want to be free from engagement, but if there is idle men, doing nothing, give them engagement. Now that we have got so many work. Simply unnecessarily, paid men are there for cutting vegetables. They have got so much… Means management is a rascal. Our men are idle, and they’re bringing paid men to cut vegetables and paying two hundred rupees. This is management. First of all, whatever business is already there, engage them. Then bring further engagement. Now he has understood the situation. Do it very carefully. Don’t make plan for squandering money. There are so many engagements. They’re not doing anything. They’re bringing one paid man to do the work. And you are finding out another engagement. Apply some brain. Devotee (1): Srila Prabhupada, you always called Back to Godhead magazine the backbone of Hare Krsna movement. You have many times said that the Back to Godhead magazine is the backbone of Hare Krsna movement. So it is my ardent desire that the Hindi Back to Godhead should be made a regular monthly. Prabhupada: Why don’t you make? Devotee (1): There are printing and distribution problems. Gopala Krsna: We had a big stock of our old issue. We had printed seventy thousand of that. There’s only few thousand left, and we have a lot of… Prabhupada: If you have got distribution problem, then you… Gopala Krsna: And we have a lot of small books which we have just printed. So I wanted the small books to be cleared out. Like in Germany and France also they don’t do Back to Godhead every month. They do it every few months so that they can get the books out. Prabhupada: It doesn’t matter. Every month, if we regularly publish, we get some postal (indistinct). That’s… If you every month publish some in certain date, you get very cheap rate for posting. That… All right. So a good thing… [break] Very good boy. So Gaurasundara, if he joins there, it will be still more brilliant for both of them. Because you have got the talent. You are not to be taught. You can teach others how to make dolls. And profusely make this doll exhibition from Bhagavata. Yes. There’s no need of reading book. They will see and understand Bhagavata. Everywhere, in every branch, you see how many tourists you attract. Do all these things. Krsna has given all assistance: money, men, endeavor. Now utilize it properly. Just see how nicely they have made. Nobody will understand this is doll. As if actual photograph. Tamala Krsna: Actually, when I showed someone that photograph of Your Divine Grace in the Radha-Damodara room, you know, that doll exhibit, he said, “Who took this photo so many years ago?” I said, “No, this is not a photo. This is doll exhibit.” This was a devotee of yours. They thought it was a photograph taken ten years ago or twelve years ago. They couldn’t understand that it was a doll. Prabhupada: At least in London, in Hawaii, then… What is called? Devotee (2): Washington? Prabhupada: No, the palace. Tamala Krsna: France. Germany. Prabhupada: No. Tamala Krsna: You have so many palaces we don’t know which one you mean. Oh, Detroit. Prabhupada: Hm. Tamala Krsna: That’s a good place for it, Detroit. They’re planning a big one in Washington, D.C. Prabhupada: Do it first. In Hawaii the Deities are made of paper combination? Gurukrpa: Now Bharadvaja is making like this. Prabhupada: Oh, very good. Gurukrpa: He’s already… He will be finished in two or three weeks. Tamala Krsna: These are very hard, aren’t they? It seems very… Prabhupada: Yes. It is as good as marble. Gurukrpa: He’s already started. Prabhupada: That’s good. The old Deities, when the new Deities come, old Deities should be thrown in the ocean. That’s it. And new Deities should be replaced with ceremony. There is no difficulty. Gurukrpa: I got now an Australian passport, so I want to stay in India for some time. Prabhupada: Oh. That’s good. Gurukrpa: Everything has been… There’s not much for me to do there. Srutakirti is doing it. Prabhupada: That’s nice. He is very intelligent. Gurukrpa: Yes. I just have to go sometimes and like that. There’s not much for me to do, and I cannot do anything in Japan now, so I’ve come here to find some service. Prabhupada: Tell him. His name has been submitted. Tamala Krsna: For residency? He doesn’t need it. He says he’s arranged an Australian passport. Gurukrpa: I have now… I am an Australian. Prabhupada: Oh. (laughs) Tamala Krsna: He’s changed his nationality. Prabhupada: Oh. Commonwealth. Tamala Krsna: All the men are like that? Gurukrpa: No, most. Bhanu has come with me now. He’s here. Tamala Krsna: He’s Canadian. Gurukrpa: He’s Canadian. And I have some Australians and English boys with me. Prabhupada: So stay. Tamala Krsna: Here’s Bhanu, Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada: Oh! Yasodanandana dasa. I am very glad to see you. Keeping good health? Bhanu: Yes. Prabhupada: That’s nice. Tamala Krsna: You personally made Bhanu a devotee, Srila Prabhupada. Took him with you. Prabhupada: He can worship Deity very good. Upendra: In Hawaii he introduced very high standard of Deity worship, Bhanu did. Tamala Krsna: Gurukrpa brought his Deities, little Gaura-Nitai. He’s wondering where will be a good place to keep them while he’s here in Vrndavana. Prabhupada: The altar? Gurukrpa: No, that’s not… Tamala Krsna: It’s difficult. He says… Gurukrpa: I’d like to bring them in daily for you to have darsana since you cannot go to the Deity. Prabhupada: No, I go. Tamala Krsna: Prabhupada goes every day. Difficult to put ’em in here? Prabhupada: But very carefully it should be done.(?) Gurukrpa: Yes. Tamala Krsna: His Deities. You have a lot of jewels with you. Gurukrpa: I can’t keep them on the altar. Prabhupada: If you like, you can keep in private room also. Gurukrpa: Yes, that is better. Tamala Krsna: They’ve arranged a very big room for the men, the biggest room here, so it’s practically like a temple room in itself. It’s where the gurukula used to be. Gurukrpa: It is better. We cook separate for Them. Prabhupada: Cook separate? Gurukrpa: Just for the Deity. Prabhupada: That is not very good. Tamala Krsna: It’s not a big thing here to cook. Prabhupada Prabhupada: Patram puspam phalam toyam. No cooking. Tulasi and jala. You can offer little fruits, nuts, milk. No need of cooking. Takes much time. I want here no hired… But for the Deities and the devotees it is false.(?) Their association is bad. Make some arrangement so that you can avoid hired cooks unless it is absolutely necessary. The hired cook, they are most wretched people. Tamala Krsna: Srila Prabhupada, it’s about twelve-twenty. Maybe you want to take your message now. [break] (Bengali conversation with Bhakti-caru) (end)
with His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada
August 8, 1977, Vrndavana