RC NAI 1975-11-01 Lord's Gigantic Body
ANNOUNCER: Next is a conversation with
His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda,
recorded on November 1st, 1975, in Nairobi, Kenya.
PRABHUPĀDA: …explaining last night that earth, water, air, fire,
they have come from Kṛṣṇa’s energy.
Can you explain how it has come?
Any one of you.
People may say that “You can say like that,
but prove that the earth has come from Kṛṣṇa.”
DEVOTEE (1): You said last night… You mentioned a verse from the Bhagavad-gītā,
ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo [Bg. 10.8]
- that Kṛṣṇa is the source of everything. - That’s all right.
That is… Your scripture says, but I am a third person.
Why shall I believe in your scripture?
You prove.
You are quoting from your own scripture.
I don’t take your scripture.
You give me practical explanation how earth has come from Kṛṣṇa.
Well, one has to accept the scriptures.
- So that you may accept. - This is what Kṛṣṇa has left here five thousand years ago.
“That’s all right.
It doesn’t matter.
- That doesn’t matter.” - for everyone because you are part of Kṛṣṇa too.
- That is your saying. You prove that. - That’s not my saying. That’s the Supreme Lord’s saying.
- That’s all right. - INDIAN MAN OR DEVOTEE (2): …a child has to accept the authority of her mother,
- to know about our father. - That is all right,
but you give some practical explanation that how water, earth has come from…
The only practical explanation we can have or any living entity has
is that explanation which his father gives him,
- the Supreme Lord gives him. - He has given us…
- That is all right. Still… - …explanation in the Bhagavad-gītā.
vijñāna means jñāna and viveka.
Viveka means, personal conviction.
That is called vijñāna.
Jñāna and vijñāna.
One knowledge you get from me,
and then you practically apply your consciousness that
“Yes, what Prabhupāda has said, it is right.”
That is called vijñāna.
One knowledge, accepting blindly from the authority, that is knowledge.
But how it is practically made or done, that understanding is called vijñāna.
- DEVOTEE (2): We have so many examples of… - Give that example; that I wanted.
We have so many examples of scientific creations by intelligent brain,
personalities on this planet, so many things which we can see,
like the clothes we wear, and the machines we are using in our everyday lives,
- which require… - So how Kṛṣṇa has prepared earth?
- That I want. - So we can see by studying the nature
- Yes. - of the construction of this earth that it is much more intelligent…
So how earth is coming from Kṛṣṇa?
Tell me that.
DEVOTEE (3): The scientists say that this earth came from gases,
but they cannot explain exactly where those gases have come from.
That is, that source, that is Kṛṣṇa.
No, they do not know, but we know.
How in your belly gas is formed?
How?
There was no gas, but automatically the gas is formed.
And therefore sometimes, if it is much gas, then you go for treatment.
So this is the practical.
The gas is also generating from my body.
So as I am an individual, insignificant body,
if there is possibility of generating little gas, so Kṛṣṇa’s gigantic body,
why not gigantic volume of gas?
This is the explanation.
JÑĀNA: The materialistic scientists, they are saying that matter is energy.
So we understand if it’s energy there must be an energetic.
Yes.
So how the energetic is producing, this is common.
Gas is forming.
Just like you perspire, there is water.
So one ounce of water may come from your body.
So water is coming from your body, so why not from the gigantic body of Kṛṣṇa,
the oceans, millions of oceans, come out?
This should be the understanding.
We see practically that water is coming out from my body.
So it may be one ounce or less than that because my body is very small,
but Kṛṣṇa’s body is unlimited, so why not unlimited supply of water?
This should be the common sense.
And this body, this body, what it is?
It is earth.
When the body will be dead it will be earth.
So I am spirit soul, a small particle,
so much earth is coming from me, why not Kṛṣṇa, the supreme spirit?
This is the explanation.
God is great, I am small.
From me a small quantity of earth is coming, water is coming.
Why not from the gigantic body of Kṛṣṇa, so huge,
I mean to say, volume of water, gas, and everything as we see it is coming?
So therefore Kṛṣṇa is correct.
He’s correct, but for our understanding we can understand like this,
chemicals, the chemicals coming from our body.
There are so many salt.
And you test the blood or the perspiration.
You’ll find so many chemicals.
BRAHMĀNANDA: For us to… For our body to produce earth…
Now, just to understand that I am part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa,
so the chemical and the water and the earth is coming from my body,
so why not Kṛṣṇa’s body, gigantic, the greatest,
the chemicals, water, earth, water…?
When Kṛṣṇa says, bhūmir āpo ’nalo.
“It is My energy,” that’s fact.
Where is the difficulty to understand?
We can… We are little sample of God, a small God.
So if we can produce, this body… The spirit soul as I have described yesterday,
one ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair, it is very, very minute.
From that minute spirit so much earth, water, fire is coming.
So why not the supreme spirit, huge quantity of water, earth, will not come?
How one can deny it?
HARIKEŚA: Well, but verbal analogies don’t prove the scientific a fact.
Then you are a rascal.
Verbal analogy is proof.
A small quantity, a small quantity producing;
large quantity, large quantity producing.
Where is the verbal?
This is practical.
- But that’s assuming that God has a body, or there even is a God. - Yes, God has a body.
Huh?
But that is… You are blind rascal, you cannot see.
That does not mean that He has no body.
You cannot see even the president’s body here.
That means president has no body?
You rascal, you cannot understand.
Because you cannot see the president’s body, you cannot say,
“No, the president is bodyless.”
That is your defect.
You become qualified to see the president.
You’ll see he has got a body.
Those who are not qualified to see him, they can say that he has not body.
But why he has no body?
Śāstra says.
So if you remain fools and rascals, that is another thing, but He has a body.
iśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ [Bs. 5.1]
Brahmā is saying.
Why He has no body?
sac-cid-ānanda-vigraha [Bs. 5.1]
Vigraha means body.
But we don’t know, so we’re taking
- the known and speculating on that… - You do not know; therefore you have to learn.
If you want to remain rascal, fool, and still you want to know, that is not possible.
You have to know from the real source.
Then you’ll know.
But if you keep yourself in the rascal platform, then how you will know?
Just like you have to go to a school to learn things.
So how you can learn at home?
tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet [MU 1.2.12]
You have to go in order to understand that science.
So how do you argue, keeping yourself in darkness?
In darkness you cannot see anything.
“Oh, I do not see anything; therefore there is nothing.”
Is that very good reason?
You are blind, you cannot see the darkness.
That is another thing.
But things are there.
You make your eyes operated and manifest your vision.
Then you’ll see.
Therefore,
ajñāna-timirāndhasya jñānāñjana-śalākayā
cakṣur-unmīlitaṁ yena tasmai śrī-gurave namaḥ [Śrī Guru Praṇāma]
Everyone is blind, in darkness.
He cannot see anything.
So one who opens the eyes, jñānāñjana-śalākayā,
by the torch of knowledge, he is guru.
This is description of guru.
If you are blind and have a blind guru, that is no use.
Guru means who is not blind.
I may be blind.
Then that will be effective.
This is no reason, “I cannot see.”
What you are?
You can see?
You cannot see even the president,
and you want to see God without being qualified?
This is laymans’, rascal’s reason, “I cannot see.
I do not see.”
What you are?
What you can see?
You do not first of all evaluate what is your position, and you want to see something.
The formula is there.
premāñjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu vilokayanti [Bs. 5.38]
One who has developed love of God is always seeing God.
So where is that qualification?
You are not lover of God, you are lover of dog, so how you can see God?
You can see dog.
That’s all.
Go on seeing dog perpetually.
And at the time of death see the dog and become a dog.
That’s all.
Subtitles by Gopī Kāntā Dāsa, Causelessmercy.com Sponsored by Dr. Douglas Maki