0 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:16,176 RC WDC 1976-07-08 S. Damodar--Life Comes By the --etc 1 00:00:16,177 --> 00:00:18,416 ANNOUNCER: The following is a conversation 2 00:00:18,417 --> 00:00:23,826 with His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda, 3 00:00:23,827 --> 00:00:47,436 recorded on the 8th of July, 1976, in Washington, D.C. 4 00:00:47,437 --> 00:00:50,616 SVARŪPA DĀMODARA: There is an international meeting coming up next year 5 00:00:50,617 --> 00:00:55,366 on the origin of life, in Japan, Tokyo. 6 00:00:55,367 --> 00:01:00,216 They have an international body called International Society 7 00:01:00,217 --> 00:01:03,596 for the Study of the Origin of Life, 8 00:01:03,597 --> 00:01:07,306 and there are participants from all over the world actually. 9 00:01:07,307 --> 00:01:11,427 They hold this meeting once every four years. 10 00:01:11,428 --> 00:01:14,417 Next one is scheduled to be in Tokyo. 11 00:01:14,418 --> 00:01:21,877 We were thinking that if we get some material, we’ll go and represent there. 12 00:01:21,878 --> 00:01:23,987 RŪPĀNUGA: Scientists will come there from around the world? 13 00:01:23,988 --> 00:01:29,317 SVARŪPA DĀMODARA: Oh, yeah, big, big scientists. 14 00:01:29,318 --> 00:01:33,747 PRABHUPĀDA: But they are biased on the point that origin of life is chemical. 15 00:01:33,748 --> 00:01:34,997 Oh, yes. 16 00:01:34,998 --> 00:01:38,587 Everybody is coming for them one hundred percent. 17 00:01:38,588 --> 00:01:40,557 What is the discussion then? 18 00:01:40,558 --> 00:01:43,457 Oh, some will, you know, “I have done this experiment, 19 00:01:43,458 --> 00:01:46,527 and this looks very possible that 20 00:01:46,528 --> 00:01:55,387 about four billion years ago there was some chemical that, ah, get life.” 21 00:01:55,388 --> 00:02:00,047 So if we go there, there will be a big fight. [splice] 22 00:02:00,048 --> 00:02:02,927 No, you can challenge them with this, 23 00:02:02,928 --> 00:02:08,287 that “Why don’t you prepare a chemical egg 24 00:02:08,288 --> 00:02:14,737 and give it to the incubator and let life come? 25 00:02:14,738 --> 00:02:19,217 If you cannot do that, then don’t talk nonsense.” 26 00:02:19,218 --> 00:02:22,757 This is simple thing. 27 00:02:22,758 --> 00:02:29,598 Analyze, take a sparrow’s egg, small, analyze what chemicals there are, 28 00:02:29,599 --> 00:02:33,158 and combine in the same way. 29 00:02:33,159 --> 00:02:38,188 Why they do not do that? 30 00:02:38,189 --> 00:02:39,808 Too hard. 31 00:02:39,809 --> 00:02:45,128 Then why do they talk nonsense? 32 00:02:45,129 --> 00:02:48,698 You stress on this point. 33 00:02:48,699 --> 00:02:53,708 If they say “Yes, we shall do after millions of years,” 34 00:02:53,709 --> 00:02:58,688 then he should be challenged that “You give up your title, 35 00:02:58,689 --> 00:03:07,728 “Doctor” let the sparrow take it. He’s doing. 36 00:03:07,729 --> 00:03:12,468 You give up, nonsense, your title. Don’t talk nonsense. 37 00:03:12,469 --> 00:03:19,508 The sparrow, without taking any doctorate title, he’s doing that. 38 00:03:19,509 --> 00:03:21,908 So what is the value of your doctorate title?” 39 00:03:21,909 --> 00:03:27,178 Challenge him. Seriously challenge. 40 00:03:27,179 --> 00:03:33,848 This point you present, they cannot do it, it is certain. 41 00:03:33,849 --> 00:03:38,588 It is not possible to be done like that. 42 00:03:38,589 --> 00:03:43,728 Spirit soul is different complete from the matter. 43 00:03:43,729 --> 00:03:47,458 They have to acknowledge it. 44 00:03:47,459 --> 00:03:51,528 Just like this house, a combination of matter. 45 00:03:51,529 --> 00:04:00,708 But I am within this room, that does not mean I am this matter. 46 00:04:00,709 --> 00:04:07,269 Similarly, I am within this body, but that does not mean I am this body. 47 00:04:07,270 --> 00:04:10,749 This chemical composition is suitable arrangement, 48 00:04:10,750 --> 00:04:16,019 like this house is made with bricks, with lime, with stone, with wood. 49 00:04:16,020 --> 00:04:25,579 But as a living being, I am not identified with all those. 50 00:04:25,580 --> 00:04:35,479 Similarly, the body, it may be combination of chemicals, but the life is different. 51 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:37,939 SADĀPŪTA: So even if they could put the chemicals together, 52 00:04:37,940 --> 00:04:40,959 a spirit soul would still have to enter in order for it to become animated. 53 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,719 Yes. 54 00:04:44,720 --> 00:04:48,329 My feelings is that even if they make these chemicals, 55 00:04:48,330 --> 00:04:55,299 the spirit is never going to come in that medium. Otherwise… 56 00:04:55,300 --> 00:05:05,369 No, because it will… It comes by superior order, not by your order. 57 00:05:05,370 --> 00:05:07,629 Daiva-netreṇa. [splice] 58 00:05:07,630 --> 00:05:09,869 You cannot do it. 59 00:05:09,870 --> 00:05:13,269 You once said that because people 60 00:05:13,270 --> 00:05:16,269 are becoming more educated and scientific-minded, 61 00:05:16,270 --> 00:05:19,199 they are rejecting these religions. 62 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:22,529 So similarly, because they are becoming more educated and scientific minded… 63 00:05:22,530 --> 00:05:25,780 So-called educated, they are becoming fools. 64 00:05:25,781 --> 00:05:28,280 But still, they are challenging. 65 00:05:28,281 --> 00:05:32,550 But they, for the same reason, will challenge the scientists in due time. 66 00:05:32,551 --> 00:05:36,000 Because they become…, if they become more scientific-minded, 67 00:05:36,001 --> 00:05:39,260 then they will challenge these statements that the scientists never verify. 68 00:05:39,261 --> 00:05:42,280 Constantly they are saying, but they never do anything. 69 00:05:42,281 --> 00:05:45,710 Our challenge should be “Do it.” 70 00:05:45,711 --> 00:05:51,600 If you cannot do it, then you give up your title, let it go to the chicken. 71 00:05:51,601 --> 00:05:52,170 Huh? 72 00:05:52,171 --> 00:06:02,720 What is the wrong there, if we say “Dr. Chicken,” “Dr. Frog”? 73 00:06:02,721 --> 00:06:08,500 These theories of theirs are taught in high schools and colleges as fact, practically. 74 00:06:08,501 --> 00:06:12,920 Like the student in Gainesville was telling us that he was taking zoology, 75 00:06:12,921 --> 00:06:14,140 and they were teaching evolution, 76 00:06:14,141 --> 00:06:17,910 and they were saying that it wasn’t a theory anymore but it was a proven fact, 77 00:06:17,911 --> 00:06:20,780 and that he was quite dissatisfied with that. 78 00:06:20,781 --> 00:06:22,150 Proven fact? 79 00:06:22,151 --> 00:06:23,460 Yes, that’s how they are teaching it. 80 00:06:23,461 --> 00:06:26,861 They don’t even teach evolution as a theory anymore, 81 00:06:26,862 --> 00:06:31,961 but they say it’s been proven as a fact now, what they are teaching. 82 00:06:31,962 --> 00:06:36,771 So how it is fact? You cannot do. So what is the fact? 83 00:06:36,772 --> 00:06:40,041 They are cheating. [splice] 84 00:06:40,042 --> 00:06:46,941 They call… Because they use a Sanskrit word for this life coming from chemicals, 85 00:06:46,942 --> 00:06:55,141 they call jīvana particles of life. 86 00:06:55,142 --> 00:07:01,611 So they are also catching this idea that life is nothing but molecules. 87 00:07:01,612 --> 00:07:06,731 So along with this article, they are also writing from Bombay. 88 00:07:06,732 --> 00:07:12,121 So actually it is worldwide, all over, this concept. [splice] 89 00:07:12,122 --> 00:07:16,321 Just like that Dr. Sharma, who came yesterday, 90 00:07:16,322 --> 00:07:20,181 he’s very much along our thought. 91 00:07:20,182 --> 00:07:22,741 Who wrote the book? 92 00:07:22,742 --> 00:07:27,351 No, no, an Indian gentleman. 93 00:07:27,352 --> 00:07:32,681 He has several degrees in science area, and he has an important post. 94 00:07:32,682 --> 00:07:33,931 Dr. Sharma? 95 00:07:33,932 --> 00:07:35,411 Who came yesterday. 96 00:07:35,412 --> 00:07:37,801 Sanskrit, he knows Sanskrit well? 97 00:07:37,802 --> 00:07:38,541 From Hardwar? 98 00:07:38,542 --> 00:07:40,722 No. 99 00:07:40,723 --> 00:07:43,312 So why don’t you take him? 100 00:07:43,313 --> 00:07:47,792 Oh, yes, he’s very willing to help anything along these lines. 101 00:07:47,793 --> 00:07:49,372 But he told me that 102 00:07:49,373 --> 00:07:53,292 once we have this Bhaktivedanta Institute and we have this done, 103 00:07:53,293 --> 00:07:55,802 he told us that he can find some means 104 00:07:55,803 --> 00:07:58,412 by which we can get some grant from the government. 105 00:07:58,413 --> 00:08:01,612 There are several funding agencies, 106 00:08:01,613 --> 00:08:05,522 and he’s one of the important men for giving grants, 107 00:08:05,523 --> 00:08:09,082 and he has several connections with the top rank… 108 00:08:09,083 --> 00:08:11,592 Authorities. 109 00:08:11,593 --> 00:08:15,292 So keep connection with him. 110 00:08:15,293 --> 00:08:17,262 Yes. 111 00:08:17,263 --> 00:08:20,903 And he even wants to write some articles along these lines. 112 00:08:20,904 --> 00:08:21,673 Yes. 113 00:08:21,674 --> 00:08:25,713 He is favorable, keep in [indistinct] [splice] 114 00:08:25,714 --> 00:08:29,183 …I personally wanted to ask was about the ārati, 115 00:08:29,184 --> 00:08:34,123 in offering ārati, now we blow the conchshell, but, ah, 116 00:08:34,124 --> 00:08:38,183 coming out the pūjārī from the altar, outside, 117 00:08:38,184 --> 00:08:42,963 when the pūjārī blows the conchshell, he does this, 118 00:08:42,964 --> 00:08:46,253 especially in Atlanta, and I think in other temples also I have seen, 119 00:08:46,254 --> 00:08:49,723 the pūjārī comes out of the… 120 00:08:49,724 --> 00:08:52,553 Yes, he comes on this side of the altar and blows the conchshell. 121 00:08:52,554 --> 00:08:53,303 Is that all right? 122 00:08:53,304 --> 00:08:56,653 It should be behind the curtain or in front of the curtain? 123 00:08:56,654 --> 00:08:57,523 Behind the curtain? 124 00:08:57,524 --> 00:08:58,933 He should blow it behind. 125 00:08:58,934 --> 00:09:01,343 No, what he does is, 126 00:09:01,344 --> 00:09:07,093 the pūjārī comes out while the other devotees are there, behind the curtain, 127 00:09:07,094 --> 00:09:10,544 and then blows the conchshell. 128 00:09:10,545 --> 00:09:15,144 To make the sound audible? 129 00:09:15,145 --> 00:09:18,254 But there is no harm. Inside. 130 00:09:18,255 --> 00:09:22,554 But this disturbs something to the whole scene, 131 00:09:22,555 --> 00:09:26,874 because he has to remove the chain and cross it and then… 132 00:09:26,875 --> 00:09:32,814 No, no. Why? There is no need. 133 00:09:32,815 --> 00:09:36,084 No need of crossing the chain. 134 00:09:36,085 --> 00:09:37,654 But it can be done inside then? 135 00:09:37,655 --> 00:09:39,394 Why not? It can be done. 136 00:09:39,395 --> 00:09:42,684 HARI−ŚAURI: I think they took that from Vṛndāvana. 137 00:09:42,685 --> 00:09:44,214 In Vṛndāvana, they blow the conchshells, 138 00:09:44,215 --> 00:09:49,214 they come out onto that little balcony and blow. 139 00:09:49,215 --> 00:09:51,524 I also wanted to ask a question, Śrīla Prabhupāda, 140 00:09:51,525 --> 00:09:56,984 on dancing in the temple room during ārati, especially maṅgala-ārati. 141 00:09:56,985 --> 00:10:01,734 Is it not that the devotees should not turn their back while dancing to the Deity? 142 00:10:01,735 --> 00:10:03,234 No, no. 143 00:10:03,235 --> 00:10:07,714 And that they should not bump each other or dance with each other personally, 144 00:10:07,715 --> 00:10:09,734 distracting the attention from the Deity? 145 00:10:09,735 --> 00:10:14,814 Shouldn’t all the dancing be focused toward the Deity? 146 00:10:14,815 --> 00:10:27,245 Sometimes dancing is done here in peculiar method. [laughter]. 147 00:10:27,246 --> 00:10:30,885 That is not desirable. 148 00:10:30,886 --> 00:10:33,725 The dancing, Caitanya Mahāprabhu is showing. 149 00:10:33,726 --> 00:10:38,235 You have shown us the feet, changing of the feet with arms upraised, 150 00:10:38,236 --> 00:10:40,145 not with the back to the Deity. 151 00:10:40,146 --> 00:10:44,405 They do it out of sentiment, but that is not very good. 152 00:10:44,406 --> 00:10:50,575 Also they bump one another with the drum or with each other’s bodies, 153 00:10:50,576 --> 00:10:53,435 they dance and they bump like this. 154 00:10:53,436 --> 00:10:56,175 That is not bona fide is it? 155 00:10:56,176 --> 00:10:58,955 It is very popular in our movement now. 156 00:10:58,956 --> 00:11:03,095 They are inventing. 157 00:11:03,096 --> 00:11:07,875 What can I do? If you invent your own way… [splice] 158 00:11:07,876 --> 00:11:10,715 DEVOTEE: At what point is a householder to know 159 00:11:10,716 --> 00:11:15,065 when he should leave his family or her family? 160 00:11:15,066 --> 00:11:18,175 After fifty years of age. 161 00:11:18,176 --> 00:11:21,615 Fifty years old. 162 00:11:21,616 --> 00:11:25,905 When he is fifty years old, then he can think of leaving household. 163 00:11:25,906 --> 00:11:31,895 What if the spouse is very antagonistic toward Kṛṣṇa consciousness? 164 00:11:31,896 --> 00:11:33,526 Antagonistic? 165 00:11:33,527 --> 00:11:38,126 Opposed. 166 00:11:38,127 --> 00:11:41,066 So that is not the remedy, 167 00:11:41,067 --> 00:11:44,046 because afterwards he give up and become a sannyāsī, 168 00:11:44,047 --> 00:11:48,936 and then again become this gṛhastha. 169 00:11:48,937 --> 00:11:51,736 This is not good. 170 00:11:51,737 --> 00:11:57,326 Opposition is already there, especially in the Western countries; 171 00:11:57,327 --> 00:12:03,606 they will never agree. So why do you marry? 172 00:12:03,607 --> 00:12:06,326 That is understood. 173 00:12:06,327 --> 00:12:09,046 Huh? 174 00:12:09,047 --> 00:12:16,136 Both the boys and girls trained in such a way that there must be opposition. 175 00:12:16,137 --> 00:12:21,316 So that is expected, that in your married life there will be opposition. 176 00:12:21,317 --> 00:12:23,866 So why do you marry? 177 00:12:23,867 --> 00:12:27,386 He’s talking about if you’re married before you come to the movement 178 00:12:27,387 --> 00:12:30,036 and one person wants to join the movement 179 00:12:30,037 --> 00:12:31,316 and the other person is not very agreeable. 180 00:12:31,317 --> 00:12:37,226 No. Any… It is not because there is opposition, therefore I give up family life. 181 00:12:37,227 --> 00:12:46,146 Unless one is mature, there is no need of artificially giving up family life. 182 00:12:46,147 --> 00:12:54,176 The best thing is if one can remain without marriage. That is very good. 183 00:12:54,177 --> 00:13:07,437 No botheration. Hmm. [devotees offer obeisances] 184 00:13:07,438 --> 00:13:07,439 Subtitles by Gaurāṅga Sundara Dāsa, Causelessmercy.com