Room Conversation
with His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada
New Delhi, December 10, 1971

Prabhupada:

(yasyatma buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke) sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma-ijyadhih yat-tirtha-buddhih salile na karhicij janesv abhijnesu sa eva go-kharah [SB 10.84.13]

So the world is under the bodily concept of life, so they are thinking that “We are Americans,’’ “Indians.’’ This is the disease. So they are described as animals, go-kharah. Go means cow; kharah means ass. So this Krsna consciousness movement means to save them from this animal consciousness. Krsna consciousness means real consciousness, and without Krsna consciousness, just animals. Therefore that Prahlada Maharaja said,

sukham aindriyakam daitya deha-yogena dehinam sarvatra labhyate daivad yatha duhkham ayatnatah

Dehatma-buddhi. So long we are under the concept of this body, that “I am this body,’’ his business is sense gratification, because this body means senses. We have got varieties of senses. So the bodily concept of life means the senses are dominant. Therefore, beginning from the animals up to the human being, under the bodily concept of life they’re busy simply for sense gratification. Nature is giving chance, “All right.’’ Because everyone who has come to this material world, that is for sense gratification. Those who deny to satisfy Krsna, they are sent here, “All right, you satisfy your sense by your labor here.’’ Krsna can satisfy His senses without any labor, but we have to satisfy our senses by dint of our labor. Not easy. You cannot become a millionaire so easy, or he cannot be a citizen in the heavenly planet so easy. That is our experience. So if some man from a poor family becomes, wants to become a citizen of America, a rich man, it is not so easy. You have to undergo through so many things to get the citizenship. There are so many, that your country, yes, they have got big immigration department simply to consider this application of different countries for citizenship, or to immigrate. I have seen, in Montreal, people applying for citizenship or immigration, big line, very big line, and a similar immigration department in Canada, there is no problem. So people very much anxious to become citizens in America, because it’s a rich country. So as there is restriction here in this place, in this planet, that you cannot enter any other country… If you think their country is very nice, actually, in comparison to other countries, there are so many facilities in America. At least, one can earn money like anything. So people are inclined to become citizen. But that is not easy, even within this planet. So how you will easily enter moon planet and other heavenly planets without being competent? It is not possible.

So we are called conditioned soul because we are conditioned according to this body. Deha-yogena dehinam. The…, according to karma, the certain privileges or disadvantages, what you are destined to receive, that is already a fact according to your birth. Just like somebody’s suffering from asthma, so he has got a body from a father and mother, and from the very beginning there is asthma. That body is the symptom or the result of his past karma. Therefore the material advantages or disadvantages are already settled up according to karma. So those who are sane man, they are confident that “Krsna has given me this body according to my past karma, so let me not improve. Let me not waste my time for improving the advantages and disadvantages of this material world.’’ But you cannot do it. The body is already there, according to your karma. Karmana daiva-netrena. It is already given to you. So people should be satisfied. Just like when I got this body of an ass, so you can test. And the advantage and (indistinct) that ass is meant for becoming beast of burden. He has to do that. Similarly, there is a body, the hog, he has to eat stool. So we should know it, that either we are born in such a country, such society, the body is there, and I can get my happiness and distress according to this body. This is settled up. But they do not know. They’re simply trying to, unnecessary wasting time for bodily comforts. “Oh, you are so comfortable. Let me try.’’ Huh? “I shall try also.’’ So Prahlada Maharaja says, “No, don’t waste your time like that. Your time is very valuable.’’

So that was Vedic civilization. Brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sudra, everyone is expert, but every is engaged in Krsna consciousness. Krsna consciousness, there is no bodily barrier. No. “Because I have got a particular type of body, therefore Krsna consciousness is forbidden for me.’’ No, that is not. In any body, any circumstances, you can cultivate Krsna consciousness. But not material. But people, they do not know. They think that “Krsna consciousness there is no need, but let me improve my bodily comfort.’’ This is called illusion. He cannot improve, even by an inch, the burden, but still… But you can improve, or you can purify, your consciousness. That is open to you, oh, irrespective of bodily (indistinct). And that is actually happening. You have got a different body from the before. (indistinct) But everyone, your taking to Krsna consciousness, Krsna says, “It doesn’t matter what kind of body you have got—low born, or high born, or this born or that born. I have no such restriction. If you want Me, te ’pi yanti param gatim. Mamaivamso jiva-bhutah [Bg. 15.7], you are all My parts and parcels. Every one of you are equally important to Me.’’ And similarly, a devotee of Krsna also sees. He does not see the outward cover. He sees that “Every living entity is part and parcel of Krsna. So he is now forgetful of his real position. So let us help him that he may come to Krsna consciousness and become successful.’’ This is our position. There is no question of bodily barrier. Ahaituky apratihata. Bhakti line is so nice that there is no cause and effect. Cause and effect is for this body. Karmana, by my previous activity, I get a certain type, particular type of body, cause and effect. That is not applicable in devotional service. Ahaituky apratihata. “Because I am high-born, I will have Krsna consciousness.’’ No. Or “Because I am low-born, I cannot have Krsna consciousness.’’ That is not. Ahaituky. There is no such cause and effect. Apratihata. Apratihata, without any barrier. Everyone. The body is not barrier, we should always remember. Bodily concept of life is the consciousness of the animals, and spiritual concept of life is the consciousness of the perfect being. I am servant, eternal servant of Krsna. This we should know. We should not cry for bodily problem. We should simply try to improve our Krsna consciousness, how we can better serve Krsna. That is our business. Bodily comforts, this comfort, that is already settled up with this body. But we should also know that anyone who is Krsna conscious, if he has got any slight desire for bodily comfort, he’ll get that. He’ll get that. But without Krsna consciousness, if he tries, that is not possible. If I have got slight desire for my material improvement, Krsna will satisfy you, if you take to Krsna consciousness. That means you are double way benefited. You get Krsna consciousness as well as your desire for material benefit. That is also there. But without Krsna consciousness, if you want to improve your material condition, that is not possible. Deha-yogena de… You may become rich, that’s all right, but comfort does not depend on your richness. If you’re not Krsna conscious, it does not mean because you have got some money by struggling very hard you’ll get. There are so many rich men you’ll find, they are not comfortable. I have heard from our students, their parents, just like Syamasundara was telling, his father is taking… What is that pill?

Devotee: Sleeping tablets.

Prabhupada: Sleeping tablets. He cannot sleep. Similarly, Brahmananda was telling about his father. So if you can earn money, you can make a good bank balance, that does not mean that you will get bodily comfort. That is not. That is already fixed up, according to your karma. So don’t waste your time for improving bodily comforts. Simply try to improve how you’ll become more and more Krsna conscious, how you will serve Krsna more and more, very nicely. That should be all. Tasyaiva hetoh prayateta kovido. For that purpose our life should be engaged, not for so-called bodily comfort. That is already fixed-up.

So any questions?

Devotee: You said that if you have some material desire and you take to Krsna consciousness, you get double benefit, that the material desire is fulfilled and also you get Krsna consciousness.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Devotee: But if you have that material desire, does that slow up your advancement?

Prabhupada: By Krsna consciousness it will vanish. But Krsna is so kind, because you desire, He’ll give you. He’ll give you. Krsna is so kind that “Oh, you wanted this? All right, you take!’’ That is the benefit of Krsna consciousness. You get both these things. You reject, “No, I asked for…’’ That is real pure devotion. “For this paltry happiness I requested Krsna. What a fool I was.’’ But Krsna will give you because you desire. Therefore Dhruva Maharaja regretted that “I was such a fool that I came to in the forest Krsna for asking my father’s property. What a nonsense I was.’’ But Krsna gave. Better than. He demanded that “I shall have a property,’’ because that was child. His stepmother insulted, so he was determined. Narada Muni had requested him, “My dear boy, you are child. Why you be afflicted to this insult? Go now to play.’’ So he said, “Your instruction is very nice, but I am so degraded, I cannot accept it as such. If you kindly give me some way that I can get,’’ I mean, “material opulence better than my grandfather and father. You just give me such a post.’’ His father was Uttanapada. Grandfather was Brahma. So he wanted a post better than Brahma. So he was given: “Oh, yes, you’ll get.’’ But when he was offered a better position than Brahma, he regretted that “What I…, what a fool I was.’’ He requested, “Sir, I am very much satisfied simply by Your…’’ “Never mind. You enjoy, then you come back.’’ Krsna is so kind.

Devotee (2): …can you explain about vaibhava and prabhava?

Prabhupada: What is that?

Devotee (2): Vaibhava and prabhava.

Prabhupada: They’re nonsense. Why do you ask all these questions?

Devotee (2): It is in the Caitanya…

Prabhupada: Meher Baba?

Devotee (2): Teaching of Lord Caitanya.

Tamala Krsna: He’s not saying “Baba.’’ Something I can’t understand.

Prabhupada: Meher Baba, he’s a…

Tamala Krsna: Vaibhava.

Prabhupada: Oh, Meher…, and Vaibhava. I thought that Meher Baba. (laughter) [break] There was a Hari Baba, there was a Meher Baba. Meher Baba is famous in your country. Is it not?

Devotees: Yes.

Prabhupada: He’s a nonsense. Vaibhava, prabhava, expansion of Krsna. When the body is similar, but the color of the body different, that is called vaibhava. Just like Balarama. Balarama. Krsna’s body and Balarama, there is no bodily difference, but Krsna is blackish, Balarama is whitish. These things are described in the Teachings of Lord Caitanya. You don’t read it? Huh?

Devotee (2): Yes, it’s from the Teachings of Lord Caitanya. I wanted some explanation about all this…

Prabhupada: That explanation is there. Why you are asking me? That is… I do not remember exactly what is the features of Vaibhava. That is there. But the vaibhava, prabhava, vaibhava, vilasa, there are detailed description of Krsna’s expansions. They are described there. You can refer to. Prabhava, vaibhava, vilasa, they are expansions of Krsna’s different avatara, incarnation, and part, part of incarnation. So it is a huge list, and it’s not always possible to remember them in detail. Better refer to the book. Is that all right?

Devotee (2): Yes.

Prabhupada: The teacher will remember all the work of the dictionary. (laughs) You can refer to the dictionary. (laughter) (end)